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Post by Deleted on Apr 17, 2021 10:11:23 GMT
Wait everyone, I've got a very good one. What if the French Army decided to go with thw Foch strategy of "l'offensive à outrance", Pushing through the Rhine and basically counter-passing through Belgium. Also what if they used de Gaulle's blitzkrieg during that push ? Can you tell the time of this event? |
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Post by Don Quixote de la Mancha on Apr 17, 2021 14:13:08 GMT
Wait everyone, I've got a very good one. What if the French Army decided to go with thw Foch strategy of "l'offensive à outrance", Pushing through the Rhine and basically counter-passing through Belgium. Also what if they used de Gaulle's blitzkrieg during that push ? Can you tell the time of this event? Same period of time as the Germans are passing through Belgium and the Netherlands |
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Post by Deleted on Apr 17, 2021 14:16:52 GMT
Can you tell the time of this event? Same period of time as the Germans are passing through Belgium and the Netherlands So WW2. |
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Post by Don Quixote de la Mancha on Apr 17, 2021 14:18:23 GMT
Same period of time as the Germans are passing through Belgium and the Netherlands So WW2. Yes but at that precise period, instead of doing nothing during the Phony War, the French build up their forces on the Rhine |
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Post by Deleted on Apr 17, 2021 14:21:12 GMT
So WW2. Yes but at that precise period, instead of doing nothing during the Phony War, the French build up their forces on the Rhine Rhine is in Germany way behind the border and they do buildup their forces but mainly on Belgian Border and their plans were also sabotaged by Belgian refusal to allow troops to be put in its territory. |
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Post by Deleted on Apr 17, 2021 14:25:10 GMT
So WW2. Yes but at that precise period, instead of doing nothing during the Phony War, the French build up their forces on the Rhine De Gallue's attack was not Blitzkrieg, it was a normal competent tank attack using the superior quality of French Tanks which only one other French general was able to do. His attack get blown away by Luftwaffe. |
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Post by HangryBird on Apr 17, 2021 17:44:15 GMT
I just realized I haven't asked a question yet: What if Napoleon III's assassination attempt by Felice Orsini in 1858 was successful? I'm more interested in the political effects. The biggest impact would actually be on Italy. With Napoleon III out of the way and the fact that he was assassinated by an Italian nationalist, means that French support for the Savoys is going to stop, meaning the Savoys are going have to find another ally. Next biggest is France itself. Around 1860-1870, Napoleon III was facing great opposition in Parliament from the Republicans on the left and the Conservatives on the right. I imagine with his assassination, there would be a power struggle between his supporters and these two groups.
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Post by Don Quixote de la Mancha on Apr 17, 2021 17:58:35 GMT
I just realized I haven't asked a question yet: What if Napoleon III's assassination attempt by Felice Orsini in 1858 was successful? I'm more interested in the political effects. The biggest impact would actually be on Italy. With Napoleon III out of the way and the fact that he was assassinated by an Italian nationalist, means that French support for the Savoys is going to stop, meaning the Savoys are going have to find another ally. Next biggest is France itself. Around 1860-1870, Napoleon III was facing great opposition in Parliament from the Republicans on the left and the Conservatives on the right. I imagine with his assassination, there would be a power struggle between his supporters and these two groups. Well, this would have immense ripples, no Napoleon III, no Paris Commune, no Franco-Prussian war, no defense of the Papal States. No commune and no Italy being major ones. Perhaps Savoy turns to Prussia who was in the process of unifiying itself around the same time. A reinforced Italo-Prussian Alliance is plausible, especially with Bismarck, who I believe is in power by now. Prussian-Austrian war would be accellerated and would be on 2 fronts, perhaps causing Austria as a state to collapse, creating many states. If WW1 happens, Italy would join with the Triple-Alliance against the Entente, having already seized Dalmatia from the Austrians and seeking the return of Provence. The Russian Revolution would, instead of becoming the Soviet Union, a pseudo commune probably or becoming a different brand of communism (in theory). As for France, a return to the Republic could be forseen or a return of the Bourbons. Thiers wanted them to return after all. Ripples in Mexico would happen, the Second Pastry war never happening. Diaz maybe never coming to power which if it goes like that, the Mexican Revolution never happens. If that never happens, insane things could be plausible. |
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Post by HangryBird on Apr 17, 2021 19:17:58 GMT
I just realized I haven't asked a question yet: What if Napoleon III's assassination attempt by Felice Orsini in 1858 was successful? I'm more interested in the political effects. The biggest impact would actually be on Italy. With Napoleon III out of the way and the fact that he was assassinated by an Italian nationalist, means that French support for the Savoys is going to stop, meaning the Savoys are going have to find another ally. Next biggest is France itself. Around 1860-1870, Napoleon III was facing great opposition in Parliament from the Republicans on the left and the Conservatives on the right. I imagine with his assassination, there would be a power struggle between his supporters and these two groups. Well, this would have immense ripples, no Napoleon III, no Paris Commune, no Franco-Prussian war, no defense of the Papal States. No commune and no Italy being major ones. Perhaps Savoy turns to Prussia who was in the process of unifiying itself around the same time. A reinforced Italo-Prussian Alliance is plausible, especially with Bismarck, who I believe is in power by now. Prussian-Austrian war would be accellerated and would be on 2 fronts, perhaps causing Austria as a state to collapse, creating many states. If WW1 happens, Italy would join with the Triple-Alliance against the Entente, having already seized Dalmatia from the Austrians and seeking the return of Provence. The Russian Revolution would, instead of becoming the Soviet Union, a pseudo commune probably or becoming a different brand of communism (in theory). As for France, a return to the Republic could be forseen or a return of the Bourbons. Thiers wanted them to return after all. Ripples in Mexico would happen, the Second Pastry war never happening. Diaz maybe never coming to power which if it goes like that, the Mexican Revolution never happens. If that never happens, insane things could be plausible. Forgot about Mexico, Napoleon III would have been dead before he could escalate the crisis into a war. |
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Post by John Marston on Apr 18, 2021 3:09:09 GMT
I just realized I haven't asked a question yet: What if Napoleon III's assassination attempt by Felice Orsini in 1858 was successful? I'm more interested in the political effects. The biggest impact would actually be on Italy. With Napoleon III out of the way and the fact that he was assassinated by an Italian nationalist, means that French support for the Savoys is going to stop, meaning the Savoys are going have to find another ally. Next biggest is France itself. Around 1860-1870, Napoleon III was facing great opposition in Parliament from the Republicans on the left and the Conservatives on the right. I imagine with his assassination, there would be a power struggle between his supporters and these two groups. The French internal political struggle would have lasted even longer then. |
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Post by Deleted on Apr 21, 2021 3:58:33 GMT
Who said Kriegsmarine had to defeat Royal Navy, it can be defeated by Luftwaffe if it had air superiority. If Germany commits itself to such a strategy, the Luftwaffe is going to need a lot more planes, a lot more pilots, a lot of more time to train said pilots. Additionally, Germany had very little capabilities in terms of naval air power; development of such capabilities was opposed by both the Luftwaffe and Kreigsmarine. Also, most of the Royal Navy casualties during Scandinavian campaign were caused by Luftwaffe. |
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Post by HangryBird on Apr 21, 2021 4:30:13 GMT
If Germany commits itself to such a strategy, the Luftwaffe is going to need a lot more planes, a lot more pilots, a lot of more time to train said pilots. Additionally, Germany had very little capabilities in terms of naval air power; development of such capabilities was opposed by both the Luftwaffe and Kreigsmarine. Also, most of the Royal Navy casualties during Scandinavian campaign were caused by Luftwaffe. Yeah, the Kreigsmarine didn't do so well. However, my argument is still that while bombers can work, they don't work as well as naval bombers. Also, none of this changes the fact that Germany needs time and resources that it can't afford, to drastically expand the Luftwaffe to defeat the RAF in a battle of attrition and develop the amphibious capabilities for naval invasions. |
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Post by Rodolfo Graziani on Apr 25, 2021 12:21:07 GMT
What does Italy have to do during WW2 to actually be competent and be an asset to the axis? Also, if Mussolini was competent and Hitler didn't have to help Mussolini that much because of this, how would that change the world?
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Post by HangryBird on Apr 25, 2021 16:06:20 GMT
What does Italy have to do during WW2 to actually be competent and be an asset to the axis? Also, if Mussolini was competent and Hitler didn't have to help Mussolini that much because of this, how would that change the world? The Under-Secretary of War, Carlo Favagrossa, said that Italy wouldn't be ready for war until late 1942/early 1943. Italy did terrible because of its lack of military readiness. Immediately, Italy had many of its trade vessels seized because Mussolini declared war without bringing them back to Italy. Also, Malta wasn't defended so heavily as it was later in the war. Italy could have seized it if they realized its strategic importance. Overall, military equipment and military leadership were outdated and bad respectively. I think that Italy couldn't have done much to improve their performance. If they sit out of the war until late 1942/early 1943, Mussolini is much more likely to not join the axis. Sure, due to not having to assist Italy, Germany is probably doing better against Russia. However, Germany will still lose for the same reasons as OTL. The failed attack on Moscow will still happen and Mussolini, being the opportunist he is, will reconsider joining the axis and wait to see how the Eastern Front develops before making a decision. If Italy is to be an axis member, they would join the war as OTL, which leaves little room for improvement. |
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Post by STILETT0 on Apr 25, 2021 18:38:09 GMT
What does Italy have to do during WW2 to actually be competent and be an asset to the axis? Also, if Mussolini was competent and Hitler didn't have to help Mussolini that much because of this, how would that change the world? The Under-Secretary of War, Carlo Favagrossa, said that Italy wouldn't be ready for war until late 1942/early 1943. Italy did terrible because of its lack of military readiness. Immediately, Italy had many of its trade vessels seized because Mussolini declared war without bringing them back to Italy. Also, Malta wasn't defended so heavily as it was later in the war. Italy could have seized it if they realized its strategic importance. Overall, military equipment and military leadership were outdated and bad respectively. I think that Italy couldn't have done much to improve their performance. If they sit out of the war until late 1942/early 1943, Mussolini is much more likely to not join the axis. Sure, due to not having to assist Italy, Germany is probably doing better against Russia. However, Germany will still lose for the same reasons as OTL. The failed attack on Moscow will still happen and Mussolini, being the opportunist he is, will reconsider joining the axis and wait to see how the Eastern Front develops before making a decision. If Italy is to be an axis member, they would join the war as OTL, which leaves little room for improvement. If anyone wants to argue, remember that Operation Compass was supposed to be a 5-day raid, yet they ended up at Derna. |
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