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Post by Sviatoslav I Igorevich on Sept 17, 2022 17:09:11 GMT
2% difference it's same %. What 2%. The difference between triple charges of Cataphracts and Noble cavalry? How on earth have you calculated it  ? Between charge probability for Cataphracts lvl 15 and Templars lvl 8. In mix legion better use lvl 8 Templars. |
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Post by verily on Sept 17, 2022 17:17:14 GMT
2% difference it's same %. What 2%. The difference between triple charges of Cataphracts and Noble cavalry? How on earth have you calculated it ? maybe this sample kingbutawl The first setup with triple NC and triple charge’s got 1389 damage. The second one with triple CA and perfect charge has dealt 1385. |
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Post by stoic on Sept 17, 2022 17:24:11 GMT
What 2%. The difference between triple charges of Cataphracts and Noble cavalry? How on earth have you calculated it ? Between charge probability for Cataphracts lvl 15 and Templars lvl 8. In mix legion better use lvl 8 Templars. Why do you calculate frequency of triple charges of Cataphracts and Templars when we have spoken with kingbutawl about frequency of triple charges of Noble Cavalry and Cataphracts. My point was that Cataphracts do triple charges more often than Noble Cavalry. I am not a mathematician, but, if I am not mistaken, an average probability of a triple charge of 3 Noble Cavalry units is 39% and that of a triple charge of 3 Cataphracts 51%. |
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Post by verily on Sept 17, 2022 17:31:25 GMT
What 2%. The difference between triple charges of Cataphracts and Noble cavalry? How on earth have you calculated it ? Between charge probability for Cataphracts lvl 15 and Templars lvl 8. In mix legion better use lvl 8 Templars. Yes, as the charge rate of templars is high and if you have a high lv templars. mine is lv5 and i don't use it. I like to use cataphract but its lv10 vs noble cavalry lv14. it still depends on you what setup you like. i mixed legion because of bonuses. |
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Post by verily on Sept 17, 2022 17:40:08 GMT
Between charge probability for Cataphracts lvl 15 and Templars lvl 8. In mix legion better use lvl 8 Templars. Why do you calculate frequency of triple charges of Cataphracts and Templars when we have spoken with kingbutawl about frequency of triple charges of Noble Cavalry and Cataphracts. My point was that Cataphracts do triple charges more often than Noble Cavalry. I am not a mathematician, but, if I am not mistaken, an average probably of a triple charge of 3 Noble Cavalry units is 39% and that of a triple charge of 3 Cataphracts 51%. it seems he got it not from kingbutawl post, my mistake, sorry i agree that cataphract have high charge rate(because of its bonus) than noble cavalry |
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Post by kingbutawl on Sept 17, 2022 18:19:22 GMT
Between charge probability for Cataphracts lvl 15 and Templars lvl 8. In mix legion better use lvl 8 Templars. Why do you calculate frequency of triple charges of Cataphracts and Templars when we have spoken with kingbutawl about frequency of triple charges of Noble Cavalry and Cataphracts. My point was that Cataphracts do triple charges more often than Noble Cavalry. I am not a mathematician, but, if I am not mistaken, an average probability of a triple charge of 3 Noble Cavalry units is 39% and that of a triple charge of 3 Cataphracts 51%. I’m a romaboo and I’d simp for cataphracts thanks to their higher charging rate (100% charge rate with base morale if you give them to a lvl4 charge cav master general) and an attack which is equal to a T5 unit like Noble Cavalry or Boyars. Objectively cataphracts are indeed a better unit. I simply use Nobles because the game allowed me to upgrade them to lvl15 with rewards, while my cataphracts are still lvl 10 (notwithstanding some exchange with my spare souls of war). Moreover it’s better for Alfred to have a lvl 15 unique unit to eventually pair with 2 templars, in the future. The charging rate frequency is adjustable though reaching high morale (85% on Nobles and with Henry II we reach 100% charging rate). I’m always on high morale  |
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Post by Sviatoslav I Igorevich on Sept 17, 2022 18:56:58 GMT
As for me, the cataphracts were good units before my mistake with the templars, but now having templars lvl 7, boyars lvl 6 almost 7, and Noble cavalry lvl 11 almost 12, I don't need Cataphracts lvl 9 almost 10 anymore, even lvl 15. I better spend resources at other charge units. As all can see from tests, lvl 7-8 Templars better lvl 15 Cataphracts. Stoic can say anything for defend his swamp, he need this because he choose Cataphracts and get them lvl 15, but real situation another. Richard and William closed for f2p players, and for f2p players better spend resources at Boyars and Nobles cavalry, 3 can be Templars or Cataphracts, I prefer Templars, they better for most active players, because at lvl 8 they same lvl 15 Cataphracts, he choose Cataphracts this is good for f2p players who don't play every day and short at resources.
PS. Der Mohr hat seine Schuldigkeit getan, der Mohr kann gehen.
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Post by hrabrimalitoster on Sept 17, 2022 20:12:20 GMT
My brain started to melt while reading this discussion, now I have a swamp in my head 🤕
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flamma
First Lieutenant
Posts: 37
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Post by flamma on Sept 18, 2022 14:16:10 GMT
I swear this thread had only 1-2 pages a little while ago
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Post by yuanzhong on Sept 19, 2022 2:57:15 GMT
The only problem I see is what's the max lvl of units. I'm afraid it's not simple 18 or 20. The higher limit of lvl, the longer Cataphract keep their lvl advantage. If the limit is only 18 or 20, Cataphract will reach their peak soon and Templars will catch them soon and become better later. This is one of the reasons why I never use souls until now (if I can reach max lvl by grinding for other new units, why I should use souls for old units.) |
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Post by Erich on Sept 19, 2022 14:10:56 GMT
I think stoic defend his point well, better stick with Cataphracts when you don’t have enough time playing. I have Richard, but my lvl4 Templars should not be the only option. And I think the mix of Cataphracts and Templars is a good combination, Boyar too expensive, Noble Cav more expensive and less charge rate than Cataphract
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Post by Sviatoslav I Igorevich on Sept 19, 2022 16:48:47 GMT
I think stoic defend his point well, better stick with Cataphracts when you don’t have enough time playing. I have Richard, but my lvl4 Templars should not be the only option. And I think the mix of Cataphracts and Templars is a good combination, Boyar too expensive, Noble Cav more expensive and less charge rate than Cataphract Boyars give +1 movement point, it's better then charge probability, you can +1 from gear or -1 from attack, this is other strategy for charge legion's. Cataphracts good unit, good T4 unit, we don't speak about this point. |
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Post by kingbutawl on Sept 19, 2022 17:55:27 GMT
Tbh it’s just so good that we can finish campaign and conquest modes with different units. I like the possibility to actually choose between different ways |
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Post by stoic on Sept 19, 2022 18:36:32 GMT
Tbh it’s just so good that we can finish campaign and conquest modes with different units. I like the possibility to actually choose between different ways True, I like that we are somewhat forced to make decisions. No-one in the game can have all and at once. Even players with significant amount of resources have to decide what to do with their Raid Tickets and War souls. |
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Post by jonblend on Sept 19, 2022 21:51:38 GMT
If we're only looking at attack, which is paramount for charge cavalry, then lv10 Templars should be more or less the equivalent of LV15 Cataphracts. That is because number of troops also has an effect on damage. In the scenario you specified, Basil (with his skill active) was able to deal -> 1477 dmg to the left legion (3xcharge), killing one unit completely with 3x lv15 Cataphracts -> 1418 dmg to the left legion (3xcharge), killing one unit completely with 3x lv10 Templars The silver coin cost for lv15 cataphracts is (30+2+2+5+5+10+10+15+15+20+20+25+25+30+30+35)*8= 279*8= 2232 The silver coin cost for lv10 Templars is (30+2+2+5+5+10+10+15+15+20+20)*16= 134*16= 2144 Now we can ask ourselves how like it is to get a fragment for each unit in the territory shop If we look at souls, it would be 279*80= 22,320 for cataphracts and 134*200= 26,800 for Templars. But we get a lot of fragments for cataphracts (more than 40 iirc) for free through various achievements. So economically, we could even say that they break even at lv12 templars/lv15 cataphracts. The probability for triple charge is the product of all charge chances of all units capable of charging in the legion. In this case (lv15 cata and lv10 templar) it is 0.85^3= 61.4% [For Noble cav lv15 this would be 0.65^3= 27.5%] |
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