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Post by kanue on Dec 13, 2023 8:36:13 GMT
What are factors that affect the amount of resources paid for gift/agreement?
Our resource incomes? number of castles? something else?
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Post by SolidLight on Dec 13, 2023 15:30:12 GMT
What are factors that affect the amount of resources paid for gift/agreement? Our resource incomes? number of castles? something else? Just your resource income. Nothing else. Some more important stuff to note. Subjugation costs exactly twice as much as an agreement. This makes sense because allying people takes two agreements, so allying and subduing someone costs exactly the same amount. (I think, don’t really want get complicated with the success chance as a factor) You should subjugate factions that have preserve clan name if you’re entirely relying on prestige to sign agreements. That raises the odds of them bending the knee to 100%. You should try to avoid having to peace out an ambitious faction and ally them. That takes another agreement to sign, increasing the cost of doing that by 50%. That also means that you should kill Ashikaga if you ever have to fight them. The Treacherous penalty you get for doing that is no big deal if you can control it and prevent other factions from dropping below -100. So keep them around a bit until everyone’s scared of you and then finish them off. Nagao is extremely obnoxious to deal with if you’re playing on the western side. Their position on the map and chivalrous capping the alliance chance at 60% makes for a huge luck component in low turn runs. |
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Post by kanue on Dec 14, 2023 7:45:07 GMT
What are factors that affect the amount of resources paid for gift/agreement? Our resource incomes? number of castles? something else? Just your resource income. Nothing else. If it's just based on your income then does that mean you should make deal sooner than later given the same odd, assuming that your income is increasing? |
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Post by SolidLight on Dec 14, 2023 8:11:06 GMT
Just your resource income. Nothing else. If it's just based on your income then does that mean you should make deal sooner than later given the same odd, assuming that your income is increasing? Deploying generals and units is usually a better investment of your resources because they can go on to work on another clan once they finish off whatever job they have, and unit costs don’t scale with income so it’s cheaper. Therefore it’s pretty hard to justify doing these deals early on even if the prices are lower. It does mean that you should sign agreements at the start of the turn if you plan on doing that on a given turn. That’s actually pretty tricky to plan for since you should usually spend your resources at the end of the turn. Easier to avoid making dumb mistakes that way. |
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Post by riflemanhater on Dec 16, 2023 6:37:37 GMT
Some contributions to the guide:
* You have mentioned having troops in a neutral clan's land and declaring war on it decreases all those troops' morale to 0. A way to circumvent this is to have them declare war on you (by hurting relations to below -100 or stealing castles), this way you keep all your morale high, but a trade-off is that the enemy deals the first blow in their turn.
* SolidLight has mentioned the effects of Respectful attitude (-3 prestige levels), I just wanted to add that it is the highest a clan will regard another.
* On the other end of the spectrum, Underestimating attitude (+2 prestige levels) makes all diplomatic gifts result in a +0 relations. I don't know whether or not this is the lowest one regards another because I have yet to see an AI clan reach the fourth prestige level Zenith.
* It seems that the Chivalrous trait does not cap attitude at a minimum of Balanced, I have seen Nagao being Scruple.
Some observations about autopilot (legions):
* Though the autopilot is very good in campaigns and tenkabito, it is much less efficient in conquests. For instance, an unprotected branch castle can be manually occupied in two moves: a war gear blasts it then an infantry occupies it. However, the autopilot will move to gather everyone in the legion around the castle before commencing siege. Thus, I think you can do much better than the autopilot.
* Do note that the autopiloted legions will pass through non-passaged clans' land, hurting relations; and will occupy unprotected castles from anyone in its way, leading to war even with subordinate clans. So be aware of the autopilot when moving through warzone.
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Post by SolidLight on Dec 16, 2023 7:10:14 GMT
 Huh, weird. |
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Post by SolidLight on Dec 16, 2023 8:55:17 GMT
 And here’s the bonuses at Overlord. It’s a pretty no-brainer which bonus you take. |
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Post by kanue on Dec 17, 2023 4:43:45 GMT
If it's just based on your income then does that mean you should make deal sooner than later given the same odd, assuming that your income is increasing? Deploying generals and units is usually a better investment of your resources because they can go on to work on another clan once they finish off whatever job they have, and unit costs don’t scale with income so it’s cheaper. Therefore it’s pretty hard to justify doing these deals early on even if the prices are lower. It does mean that you should sign agreements at the start of the turn if you plan on doing that on a given turn. That’s actually pretty tricky to plan for since you should usually spend your resources at the end of the turn. Easier to avoid making dumb mistakes that way. Yes, that is true. But I was not make it clear  . I actually mean on the latter phase of conquest when all the generals are deployed, have conquered half of the map, and have extra resources to diplomacy. I sometimes have to make a decision between spending resources for diplomacy or stocking plie. |
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Post by SolidLight on Dec 17, 2023 7:35:35 GMT
Deploying generals and units is usually a better investment of your resources because they can go on to work on another clan once they finish off whatever job they have, and unit costs don’t scale with income so it’s cheaper. Therefore it’s pretty hard to justify doing these deals early on even if the prices are lower. It does mean that you should sign agreements at the start of the turn if you plan on doing that on a given turn. That’s actually pretty tricky to plan for since you should usually spend your resources at the end of the turn. Easier to avoid making dumb mistakes that way. Yes, that is true. But I was not make it clear . I actually mean on the latter phase of conquest when all the generals are deployed, have conquered half of the map, and have extra resources to diplomacy. I sometimes have to make a decision between spending resources for diplomacy or stocking plie. You should almost always spend all your resources on every turn unless there’s something you really, really need to save for within like 1-2 turns. At that point the only thing that fits the bill is subjugation. So you shouldn’t stockpile unless you absolutely can’t see any benefit to spending the rest. But 50% of the map really isn’t enough, it should probably be more like 70-80%. I end up killing the vast majority of factions and only ally/subjugate like 5 or 6 at the end. Deploying units is an investment, and it pays off depending on how many turns there is left. So it’s better to just buy a bunch of artillery and other units to kill a faction if you expect to be able to do that within 9 turns and you think you’ll finish the run in like 15 or so. You do diplomacy if fighting extends that time. Ideally you finish up your vassal/alliance network at the exact same time as you obliterate all your enemies. |
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Post by run4glory on Dec 17, 2023 11:22:21 GMT
Guys did I misread sth or is the info about the victory condition for hegemony wrong; I have only allies (a ton of them actually, used a lot of diplomacy - very easy with an early Karo) and subordinates left but no victory screen is popping up? I have completed all goals for the small victory as well.
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Post by Nobunaga Oda on Dec 17, 2023 11:26:18 GMT
Guys did I misread sth or is the info about the victory condition for hegemony wrong; I have only allies (a ton of them actually, used a lot of diplomacy - very easy with an early Karo) and subordinates left but no victory screen is popping up? I have completed all goals for the small victory as well. Might be a glitch. Exit the conquest game, and enter it again. Are you sure everyone is an ally or subordinate? Perhaps an ally's subordinate revolted. Lastly, just pump resources into those with the lowest diplomacy relations score. Maybe if everyone hits +150 points, it should count. |
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Post by run4glory on Dec 17, 2023 11:33:35 GMT
Double-chcked it all, yes every state left is ally and subordinate, but if 150+ for every nation is an additional requirement, my current approach might not work, since I have so many allies which are at war with each other, I have to decline all war proposals (like 5+ each turn), giving me a -30 penalty each time. So far I managed to keep everyone well over 100 tho. Maybe I identify the country with many enemies, kill them and see if 150+ for all makes it work.. I will keep you posted
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Post by stoic on Dec 17, 2023 11:38:30 GMT
Guys did I misread sth or is the info about the victory condition for hegemony wrong; I have only allies (a ton of them actually, used a lot of diplomacy - very easy with an early Karo) and subordinates left but no victory screen is popping up? I have completed all goals for the small victory as well. I think the most important thing is to reach Zenith in this situation. I have plenty of victories with relationship 100 or less with my allies. |
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Post by run4glory on Dec 17, 2023 11:44:06 GMT
Yes, thats it! Zenith is part of the victory condition. Easy to do by training a bunch of dummy troops, but one has to know.  |
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Post by Theron of Acragas on Dec 17, 2023 13:29:51 GMT
Guys did I misread sth or is the info about the victory condition for hegemony wrong; I have only allies (a ton of them actually, used a lot of diplomacy - very easy with an early Karo) and subordinates left but no victory screen is popping up? I have completed all goals for the small victory as well. Might be a glitch. Exit the conquest game, and enter it again. Are you sure everyone is an ally or subordinate? Perhaps an ally's subordinate revolted. Lastly, just pump resources into those with the lowest diplomacy relations score. Maybe if everyone hits +150 points, it should count. You definitely don't need 150+ with all allies. |
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. I actually mean on the latter phase of conquest when all the generals are deployed, have conquered half of the map, and have extra resources to diplomacy. I sometimes have to make a decision between spending resources for diplomacy or stocking plie.
