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Post by Desophaeus on Nov 24, 2016 4:26:24 GMT
PzGermany24 , Defensive properties? Are you referring to the skills? (Remember HP doesn't really mean a thing because it can always be upgraded but skills cannot be upgraded) Each and every one of his skills corresponds to dealing out damage rather than absorbing it.
Govorov has: Lvl 2 Arty Leader - basically allows a hit of max damage happen more likely (rather useless in comparison to other skills, pity. Still classified as offensive) Lvl 4 Barrage - gives additional dmg when below 50% health (this is NOT a defensive skill, this is an offensive skill that allows Govorov to continue deal out sweet damage being useful despite losing a large chunk of his health) Lvl 2 Explosives - gives more oomph in shooting down something in a city, either with or without a defending unit in the city. (Very obviously an offensive skill) Lvl 3 Plain fighting - When on a plain hex, Govorov shoots out even more damage. (Offensive, enough said, really). I would understand the confusion of classifying Barrage as a defensive skill by accident, but you have to understand the analogy here in the game of League of Legends... Just imagine Govorov in LoL as an AD Marksman shooting down enemies from a relative distance (but not so far away, he's still pretty close up in your face, putting new holes in your face) The effect of Barrage is not that after Govorov receives a AP skillshot in the face during a 2vs2 bottom lane brawl, he survives it better because of Barrage, not quite... The effect of Barrage means even with some health missing, Govorov is still capable of dealing solid AD, giving a good shot after shot, shot after shot, shot after... well, you get the idea. He's a brutal monster on the AD scale if he was in LoL instead of WC3. Govorov IS an offensive general built for offensive punching 2 hexes away (but not much further due to his low speed and almost no air stars to use).
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Post by Max Otto von Stierlitz on Nov 24, 2016 9:39:40 GMT
Seems like you're speaking about someone else. Govorov is quite easy to kill: 120 hp and artillery has less native hp than tank. Sure, if you use him wisely, he can kill human enemies faster than they kill him, but he can't receive much damage. Yes govorov is easy to kill, but once you upgrade his rank he is a beast on the battlefield. Sure. But IMO before upgrading academy gens it's better to upgrade ECs. Just because in most cases other stronger gen give you more advantage than more hp for current gens. |
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Post by Stonewall Jackson on Nov 24, 2016 17:32:34 GMT
Yes govorov is easy to kill, but once you upgrade his rank he is a beast on the battlefield. Irrelevant. Every general can be upgraded in HP (not that you would want to upgrade somebody terrible like Wingate!). Govorov is not a defensive general for absorbing damage purposes. He is effectively an offensive general dealing out damage while using an unit that you are not supposed to allow to recieve damage anyhow. Artilleries are meant for bombardment. Although the field artillery is somewhat respectable for defense against the aliens (only because all other units die too quickly due to damage bonuses aliens has). I would have to disagree with that. The way I play, i send govorov (and any other artillery generals) to do his own thing without protection, and he does fantastic. Well, I guess to each his own. |
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Post by Stonewall Jackson on Nov 24, 2016 17:36:03 GMT
Yes govorov is easy to kill, but once you upgrade his rank he is a beast on the battlefield. Sure. But IMO before upgrading academy gens it's better to upgrade ECs. Just because in most cases other stronger gen give you more advantage than more hp for current gens. Yes, but you are guaranteed a good effective general with high hp if you upgrade someone like govorov. On the other hand, if you upgrade your EC who is crap, it won't be as beneficial. I suppose it just depends on what stage your EC is at. |
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Post by Desophaeus on Nov 24, 2016 18:13:27 GMT
Irrelevant. Every general can be upgraded in HP (not that you would want to upgrade somebody terrible like Wingate!). Govorov is not a defensive general for absorbing damage purposes. He is effectively an offensive general dealing out damage while using an unit that you are not supposed to allow to recieve damage anyhow. Artilleries are meant for bombardment. Although the field artillery is somewhat respectable for defense against the aliens (only because all other units die too quickly due to damage bonuses aliens has). I would have to disagree with that. The way I play, i send govorov (and any other artillery generals) to do his own thing without protection, and he does fantastic. Well, I guess to each his own. Logically speaking, a front line unit is cheaper and moves faster than the artillery generals anyway. A motorized infantry or an armored car is quite beneficial for that kind of thing. They might not have the biggest punch, but that's not their job in this case. They only have to lure the attacks of the AI onto themselves and move around to maintain their frontier positions ahead of the artillery. The less damage to the general, the more you can use him (this applies to any). It's not that I don't want my generals to avoid damages completely, but I prefer the damage taken to be applied for a practical reason (like I need to take this particular enemy unit out to get a city, etc...). Sometimes it makes more sense to let a non-general unit absorb an attack than to be indiscriminate with your generals. Also, it's just an expense of 100 or 130 gold here and there. It's a cost-effective method to extend the life out of your artilleries with or without generals regardless. An artillery cost either 200 or 220 gold (ignore the useless 1-hex-range one). So it's like protecting your investment, especially when you have a cluster of multiple artilleries. (This is my inner Civ3 player mindset.  ) |
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Post by Max Otto von Stierlitz on Nov 24, 2016 20:31:03 GMT
Yes, but you are guaranteed a good effective general with high hp if you upgrade someone like govorov. On the other hand, if you upgrade your EC who is crap, it won't be as beneficial. I suppose it just depends on what stage your EC is at. That's right, but upgrading EC has much better results when you invest more. Upgrading Govorov can double his hp, but not always you will need it. I am now upgrading my ECs and don't really suffer from not upgraded academy gens. They have enough hp to do what I want them to do (capture enough cities to proceed without gens in conquests or do their par in campaigns). |
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Post by Stonewall Jackson on Nov 24, 2016 20:55:52 GMT
Yes, but you are guaranteed a good effective general with high hp if you upgrade someone like govorov. On the other hand, if you upgrade your EC who is crap, it won't be as beneficial. I suppose it just depends on what stage your EC is at. That's right, but upgrading EC has much better results when you invest more. Upgrading Govorov can double his hp, but not always you will need it. I am now upgrading my ECs and don't really suffer from not upgraded academy gens. They have enough hp to do what I want them to do (capture enough cities to proceed without gens in conquests or do their par in campaigns). If you look at it short term, upgrading EC is a bad Idea. But long term, it is a great idea. So you are probably right in this case |
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Post by PzGermany24 on Nov 25, 2016 3:10:45 GMT
Ok, I do see how Govorov can be more offensive, but you can't ignore the fact that he also has great potential for defense when necessary.
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Post by Desophaeus on Nov 25, 2016 3:28:27 GMT
Ok, I do see how Govorov can be more offensive, but you can't ignore the fact that he also has great potential for defense when necessary. Zuhkov would've been a better defender in this case. There's other ones good at absorbing hits too. |
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Post by border on Nov 25, 2016 8:16:45 GMT
Good discussion here guys. I went for Govor and yes, you have to protect him. No way around that. However, as someone mentioned, use him wisely, and hi is a beast. I usually put him in second or third front of attack rather then in the first.
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Post by PzGermany24 on Nov 25, 2016 13:46:00 GMT
Desophaeus, Did you mean Govorov or Zhukov, because I was still talking about Govorov.
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Post by Desophaeus on Nov 25, 2016 18:34:26 GMT
Desophaeus, Did you mean Govorov or Zhukov, because I was still talking about Govorov. Zhukov. He is a better defender than Govorov, easily. But I don't buy IAPs. |
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Post by PzGermany24 on Nov 25, 2016 18:48:55 GMT
Ah, ok.
And looking at Zhukov's stats, yes, he's admittedly better at defending.
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Post by Imperial RomeBall on Nov 25, 2016 20:35:50 GMT
hmm, never really understood Zhukov, at least in relation to the other two Grand Generals. Manstein is good Tank, Eisenhower is navy/air, while Zhukov is divided between Infantry and Artillery. He even has a pointless Tank skill taking up space already divided between inf/art. I feel like he was meant to be a jack of all trades and became jack of nothing.
I haven't actually used any of them, but I think its obvious from stars and skills.
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Post by PzGermany24 on Nov 25, 2016 20:53:27 GMT
ye. I like how we went from the original topic of a recommended general to 1.5+ pages of why Govorov is offensive / defensive & other generals like him  |
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