Kuribayashi: Diet Yamashita or just plain garbage?
Aug 19, 2020 4:48:55 GMT
Nobunaga Oda, Darth Nihilus, and 1 more like this
Post by George Washington on Aug 19, 2020 4:48:55 GMT
Hello everybody, this post was originally not going to be made until late August (my definition of late August being from the 21st to 31st), but a slight change of plans happened in which I probably wouldn't have internet connection. Anywho, today we'll be talking about General Tadamichi Kuribayashi. Some things one might know about him is his command over the Japanese at the Battle of Iwo Jima, how he made his troops hold out for 36 days instead of 5, and how he most likely also died in the same battle. Oh yeah, he was also the first general I recruited in WC4, so I have a bit of a soft spot for him. All bias put to the side, let's check him out and discuss.
Kuribayashi's first skill is Level 1 Entrenchment, which dodges 6% of artillery's damage. Survivability against artillery sounds good, especially with infantry's low defenses. For this example and all other examples, we're gonna put Kuribayashi on a quadruple stack Mechanized Infantry (so this can apply to every country seeing that not all of them have commandos). However, we'll also be using a triple stack Rocket Artillery in this example. A triple stack Rocket Artillery does 63 damage when untouched, give or take. With Kuribayashi's skill of Entrenchment, that removes approximately 4 damage from the 63, making the damage 59. A quadruple stack Mechanized Infantry has 6 Defense, and while I don't know for certainty how it works, for the sake of this post we'll make the defense stat a percentage against. IF and only IF this is correct, Kuribayashi will have 6% damage blocked from other units, but 12% blocked for artillery units. This removes an additional 4 damage, making the damage done go from 63 to 55, give or take once again. When untouched, Kuribayashi on a quadruple stack Mechanized Infantry has 310 HP, and taking into account the damage done, he'll remain with 255. This of course is all up to the defense stat of a unit being a percentage, I could be totally wrong here. However, enough of calculations because this skill can't even be upgraded until... WWII Pacific Allies 07 Battle of Iwo Jima Normal. Fitting for Kuribayashi I guess, but why so far?
Kuribayashi's middle skill is Level 3 Bayonet Charge, which does 15 more damage once the troop the general is on is at 50% of their health or less. This skill is what Kuribayashi is known for in WC3, and if I'm not mistaken you learned this move through him. However, I guess this skill is "do more damage before you die and lose a general". For one, Kuribayashi has to be at 155 or less for this skill to activate. If I'm not mistaken, units lose damage points when half health or lower, so you aren't even at the original 67 damage points you were when you first deployed him. To make the scenario worse, a triple stacked Heavy Tank comes your way. 61 damage when untouched, but don't forget that it has an unupgraded Machine Gun, which does 35% more damage to infantry. This adds 21 more damage points, making the overall damage points it has 82, give or take. Mechanized Infantry's 6 defense stat lowers it to 77, leaving Kuribayashi with 78 HP. Let's just say that with this in mind, it's basically three turns or less with Bayonet Charge if one is exactly at half the HP of 155 when Bayonet Charge becomes usable. Did I mention it can't even be upgraded until WWII Pacific Axis 06 Battle of Imphal Normal?
Kuribayashi's third and final skill is the great, powerful, and glorious Level 5 Rum- Level 1 Elastic Defense, which heals fortress units by 4 HP each turn. Y'know, this skill is so pathetic and useless, I'm not even gonna discuss it. Instead, I'll be discussing what it could have been. While I definitely think Elastic Garbage is terrible, it could have been better. Maybe start off at fortress units gaining 10 HP back instead of 4 and keep going by 5 HP per upgrade. When completely maxed, the fortifications would gain 30 HP, almost twice of what it gains now. I definitely think this could have been done with Replacement/Machinist/Depot Ship as well. An option that personally makes sense to me is to buff the attack of the fortresses by 5 or something. The skill itself is next to both Crowd Tactics and Wolfpack, both skills that boost army and navy units respectively. That's just my unprofessional opinion though, and I can see why they put it on Kuribayashi. As mentioned above, the Japanese troops lasted for 36 days on Iwo Jima instead of the expected 5 days. In the end, you can't even upgrade the skill until WWII Pacific Axis 09 Time of Glory Normal, aka the FINAL mission of the WWII Pacific scenario.
TL;DR Kuribayashi has something I like to call the "Tito problem", in which the skills he has cannot be upgraded early on.
2. Competition
It's no surprise that there are several generals in Bronze tier. However, there seem to be a lot of infantry generals in Bronze tier. Not sure who would actually but Tito unless it's for some "All Tito Run" or maybe even tasks (although Tito is better in the long term). Slim is definitely a no as all his skills are terrain skills, and only 20 medals cheaper. Tassigny is basically a 425 more expensive version of Tito without Guerilla and Replacement. Crerar also has Level 1 Entrenchment, but he also has Level 1 Infantry Leader and Level 2 Crowd Tactics while costing 500 medals less. Heinrici may also be like Slim in the regards of being 20 medals cheaper as well, but at least his skills are better than Slim's. Level 1 Rumor has a 15% chance of demoralizing the enemy (15% more than Kuribayashi), can dodge 6% of damage from air units (6% more than Kuribayashi), and a 16% chance to land a fatal blow (16% more than Kuribayashi), while being the same rank. Nasser is cheaper by 140 medals and can be considered more useful thanks to Level 3 Desert Fighting and Level 2 Plain Fighting and Raider (although after doing calculations, Nasser actually does 6 damage less with just Raider, although he does 4 more damage on a plain and 9 more damage on a desert). As for Zhu.D, Level 1 Replacement means he regains 3 more HP than Kuribayashi, Level 2 Guerilla means he dodges 24% more damage than Kuribayshi while attacking, and Level 3 Infantry Leader means he also has a 24% higher chance of landing a fatal blow.
Enough of just infantry, what about the rest of Bronze tier? Well, there's the king of Bronze who goes by the name of Messe. Then his runner-up/successor Auchinleck. Among the best of Bronze tier one can also find Terauchi, Blamey, Kuznetsov, and maybe even Badoglio. One thing these generals have in common? They're all better than Kuribayashi as a starting choice. Hell, I'd even say Bock can be considered better than Kuribayashi, and he's 275 medals more expensive. Long story short, Kuribayashi isn't gonna be bought anytime soon. Especially after the next section.
3. Savings
Just like in the Terauchi post, we'll be removing the other generals we know are must-haves like Guderian, Rommel at 40%, Konev, Leeb, etc. Instead, we'll be focusing on the Infantry generals Silver tier and higher that are probably more recommended to be bought. There's really only one infantry general from Silver tier that people like to buy, and that general is Mannerheim. Level 1 Plastic Garbage is still... well, garbage; however his other two skills are where he really stands out. We've established earlier that Kuribayashi with full HP has a damage stat of 67 on a quadruple stack Mechanized Infantry. Mannerheim has Level 3 Raider and Jungle Fighting, and with this in mind: 43 (base damage of quadruple stack Mechanized Infantry when untouched) + 8 (18% additional damage from Raider, rounded from 7.74) + 30 (additional damage from Mannerheim's stars) = 81/96 damage (when not on a jungle tile/when on a jungle tile), give or take, while doing 14/29 more damage than Kuribayashi, and only being 780 medals more expensive at 1655 medals. Moving on to Gold tier, there's the 40 percent-er, Rundstedt. Sure, he doesn't have Raider and is only doing 73/78 damage (when outside of city/when inside a city), and he also has Plastic Garbage, he has something that Mannerheim doesn't. Well, really two things with one being another empty skill slot, but in this case, it's the ability to dodge 12% of damage when atacking. To top it off, he's 505 medals more expensive than Kuribayashi when he's at a 40% discount, he's cheaper than Mannerheim by 275 medals at the price of 1380 medals. Lastly, we have another Japanese general in Gold, Yamashita. While he also has Bayonet Charge and a semi-decent skill in Ace Forces, he also has Level 1 Raider. All you really have to know is that while he doesn't do as much damage as Mannerheim (76 compared to 81/96), he has more mobility and another skill slot. Just like Mannerheim, he's more expensive by 1440 medals at a price of 2315 medals. That aside, these three are definitely generals that would be worth saving up for as infantry generals in Kuribayashi's place.
4. Conclusion
To answer the title question, Kuribayashi is not a Diet Yamashita and is in fact just plain garbage. While Entrenchment and Elastic Defense make sense due to the history behind him, Kuribayashi's skill in Bayonet Charge is not backed up historically to my knowledge. While it is what he's most known for, General Tadamichi Kuribayashi actually didn't like banzai charges, and Bayonet Charge is kind of like that in the sense that one has to deliberately put themselves in danger in order for it to work. Competition between the Bronze tier infantry generals is never good, and good old Tadamichi couldn't even hold a candle to someone like Messe. Lastly, the option of saving up for the actual Yamashita, Rundstedt, or Mannerheim is way more rewarding.
Welp, that'll be all for today. It was really painful to tear this guy apart, as he is one of my favorites due to nostalgia. Finland 1939 was made somewhat easier by him, but that was a beginner's choice. I'll be seeing you guys in approximately 2 weeks, and that's when Crerar will be seen if I don't postpone it due to procrastination or school. For now, this has been your Commander in Chief, signing off.
Kuribayashi's middle skill is Level 3 Bayonet Charge, which does 15 more damage once the troop the general is on is at 50% of their health or less. This skill is what Kuribayashi is known for in WC3, and if I'm not mistaken you learned this move through him. However, I guess this skill is "do more damage before you die and lose a general". For one, Kuribayashi has to be at 155 or less for this skill to activate. If I'm not mistaken, units lose damage points when half health or lower, so you aren't even at the original 67 damage points you were when you first deployed him. To make the scenario worse, a triple stacked Heavy Tank comes your way. 61 damage when untouched, but don't forget that it has an unupgraded Machine Gun, which does 35% more damage to infantry. This adds 21 more damage points, making the overall damage points it has 82, give or take. Mechanized Infantry's 6 defense stat lowers it to 77, leaving Kuribayashi with 78 HP. Let's just say that with this in mind, it's basically three turns or less with Bayonet Charge if one is exactly at half the HP of 155 when Bayonet Charge becomes usable. Did I mention it can't even be upgraded until WWII Pacific Axis 06 Battle of Imphal Normal?
Kuribayashi's third and final skill is the great, powerful, and glorious Level 5 Rum- Level 1 Elastic Defense, which heals fortress units by 4 HP each turn. Y'know, this skill is so pathetic and useless, I'm not even gonna discuss it. Instead, I'll be discussing what it could have been. While I definitely think Elastic Garbage is terrible, it could have been better. Maybe start off at fortress units gaining 10 HP back instead of 4 and keep going by 5 HP per upgrade. When completely maxed, the fortifications would gain 30 HP, almost twice of what it gains now. I definitely think this could have been done with Replacement/Machinist/Depot Ship as well. An option that personally makes sense to me is to buff the attack of the fortresses by 5 or something. The skill itself is next to both Crowd Tactics and Wolfpack, both skills that boost army and navy units respectively. That's just my unprofessional opinion though, and I can see why they put it on Kuribayashi. As mentioned above, the Japanese troops lasted for 36 days on Iwo Jima instead of the expected 5 days. In the end, you can't even upgrade the skill until WWII Pacific Axis 09 Time of Glory Normal, aka the FINAL mission of the WWII Pacific scenario.
TL;DR Kuribayashi has something I like to call the "Tito problem", in which the skills he has cannot be upgraded early on.
2. Competition
It's no surprise that there are several generals in Bronze tier. However, there seem to be a lot of infantry generals in Bronze tier. Not sure who would actually but Tito unless it's for some "All Tito Run" or maybe even tasks (although Tito is better in the long term). Slim is definitely a no as all his skills are terrain skills, and only 20 medals cheaper. Tassigny is basically a 425 more expensive version of Tito without Guerilla and Replacement. Crerar also has Level 1 Entrenchment, but he also has Level 1 Infantry Leader and Level 2 Crowd Tactics while costing 500 medals less. Heinrici may also be like Slim in the regards of being 20 medals cheaper as well, but at least his skills are better than Slim's. Level 1 Rumor has a 15% chance of demoralizing the enemy (15% more than Kuribayashi), can dodge 6% of damage from air units (6% more than Kuribayashi), and a 16% chance to land a fatal blow (16% more than Kuribayashi), while being the same rank. Nasser is cheaper by 140 medals and can be considered more useful thanks to Level 3 Desert Fighting and Level 2 Plain Fighting and Raider (although after doing calculations, Nasser actually does 6 damage less with just Raider, although he does 4 more damage on a plain and 9 more damage on a desert). As for Zhu.D, Level 1 Replacement means he regains 3 more HP than Kuribayashi, Level 2 Guerilla means he dodges 24% more damage than Kuribayshi while attacking, and Level 3 Infantry Leader means he also has a 24% higher chance of landing a fatal blow.
Enough of just infantry, what about the rest of Bronze tier? Well, there's the king of Bronze who goes by the name of Messe. Then his runner-up/successor Auchinleck. Among the best of Bronze tier one can also find Terauchi, Blamey, Kuznetsov, and maybe even Badoglio. One thing these generals have in common? They're all better than Kuribayashi as a starting choice. Hell, I'd even say Bock can be considered better than Kuribayashi, and he's 275 medals more expensive. Long story short, Kuribayashi isn't gonna be bought anytime soon. Especially after the next section.
3. Savings
Just like in the Terauchi post, we'll be removing the other generals we know are must-haves like Guderian, Rommel at 40%, Konev, Leeb, etc. Instead, we'll be focusing on the Infantry generals Silver tier and higher that are probably more recommended to be bought. There's really only one infantry general from Silver tier that people like to buy, and that general is Mannerheim. Level 1 Plastic Garbage is still... well, garbage; however his other two skills are where he really stands out. We've established earlier that Kuribayashi with full HP has a damage stat of 67 on a quadruple stack Mechanized Infantry. Mannerheim has Level 3 Raider and Jungle Fighting, and with this in mind: 43 (base damage of quadruple stack Mechanized Infantry when untouched) + 8 (18% additional damage from Raider, rounded from 7.74) + 30 (additional damage from Mannerheim's stars) = 81/96 damage (when not on a jungle tile/when on a jungle tile), give or take, while doing 14/29 more damage than Kuribayashi, and only being 780 medals more expensive at 1655 medals. Moving on to Gold tier, there's the 40 percent-er, Rundstedt. Sure, he doesn't have Raider and is only doing 73/78 damage (when outside of city/when inside a city), and he also has Plastic Garbage, he has something that Mannerheim doesn't. Well, really two things with one being another empty skill slot, but in this case, it's the ability to dodge 12% of damage when atacking. To top it off, he's 505 medals more expensive than Kuribayashi when he's at a 40% discount, he's cheaper than Mannerheim by 275 medals at the price of 1380 medals. Lastly, we have another Japanese general in Gold, Yamashita. While he also has Bayonet Charge and a semi-decent skill in Ace Forces, he also has Level 1 Raider. All you really have to know is that while he doesn't do as much damage as Mannerheim (76 compared to 81/96), he has more mobility and another skill slot. Just like Mannerheim, he's more expensive by 1440 medals at a price of 2315 medals. That aside, these three are definitely generals that would be worth saving up for as infantry generals in Kuribayashi's place.
4. Conclusion
To answer the title question, Kuribayashi is not a Diet Yamashita and is in fact just plain garbage. While Entrenchment and Elastic Defense make sense due to the history behind him, Kuribayashi's skill in Bayonet Charge is not backed up historically to my knowledge. While it is what he's most known for, General Tadamichi Kuribayashi actually didn't like banzai charges, and Bayonet Charge is kind of like that in the sense that one has to deliberately put themselves in danger in order for it to work. Competition between the Bronze tier infantry generals is never good, and good old Tadamichi couldn't even hold a candle to someone like Messe. Lastly, the option of saving up for the actual Yamashita, Rundstedt, or Mannerheim is way more rewarding.
Welp, that'll be all for today. It was really painful to tear this guy apart, as he is one of my favorites due to nostalgia. Finland 1939 was made somewhat easier by him, but that was a beginner's choice. I'll be seeing you guys in approximately 2 weeks, and that's when Crerar will be seen if I don't postpone it due to procrastination or school. For now, this has been your Commander in Chief, signing off.