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Post by littlecorporal on Jun 7, 2020 0:34:37 GMT
One scenario I have noticed a big difference is with artillery attacking a fort or artillery from a bunker. It seems like the defensive fire does much less damage.
For units attacking adjacent units I am not so sure of them getting the evasion bonus.
I think the output formula can give us many clues to the best value for generals,
i.e.
+4 Cavalry Sword + +6 Cavalry Pistol, total bonus +10. Divide by 2 because a general star is +5 and we have the market price of a general's cavalry star.
455 + 670= 1125/2= 562
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Post by ππ³π°π΅π΄π¬πΊ on Jun 7, 2020 13:35:57 GMT
Thank you a lot for your reply Erich von MansteinSooooo right!! : I'm sorry: I forgot completely the 15% (1/7) adding to the base for each extra formation! I always struggle with this formula, not with the factors they are great !!! I didn't find the full formula in one and the explanation starts with a 'theoretical minimum output=0' why 0 ? For "rolling a dice I would use the minimum from the table - where is coming this 0 from? I was lost at this point. the explanation handles this, for me impossible dice throw. But it's an old thread..... Supernice that you still reply!I tried it again - and following your information from the first posts the formula can be written so: + ( π²(min-max) + morale ) * formation * β₯ unit
+ β * 5 * β₯ General
+ Attack Items
- Defense Items
- 2 * Chevrons defender
- morale * formation * β₯ defender
--------------------
= #net dmg#
=============
Effective dammage = #net dmg# * EvasionFactor* RestaintFactor
β€ = Health_Coefficient (formation / general)
Evasion Factor = (100% - evasion%); with corresponding skill = 100%
What do you think? Is this still correct? - (Usually I find smaller errors ) |
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Post by ππ³π°π΅π΄π¬πΊ on Jun 8, 2020 14:01:57 GMT
Unit health coefficient: Single formation: 50-100%=5/5 30-50%=4/5 15-30%=3/5 5-15%=2/5 0-5%=1/5 Double formation: 65-100%=6/6 50-65%=5/6 30-50%=4/6 15-30%=3/6 5-15%=2/6 0-5%=1/6 Triple formation: 80-100%=7/7 65-80%=6/7 50-65%=5/7 30-50%=4/7 15-30%=3/7 5-15%=2/7 0-5%=1/7 General health coefficient: 50-100%=5/5 30-50%=4/5 15-30%=3/5 5-15%=2/5 0-5%=1/5 Very important information - thank you! I anlysed this health_coefficients. Now I think I can simplify all this different coefficients for the formula. Because unit_health_coefficients are multiplier of formation (5-7) and the general_health_coefficient is multiplied by 5. I will call it for now 'HealthFactor' (π). With: π = formation_coefficient * formation_health_coefficient
-Or-
π = 5 * general_health_coefficient So instead of different four health_coefficients tables I just need one table for all. HealthFactor π
Β min. = 1
> Β 5% = 2
> 15% = 3
> 30% = 4
> 50% = 5 maximum for Generals, maximum single formation
> 65% = 6 maximum for double formation
> 80% = 7 maximum, only tripple formation Written like this, I personally understood already much better the effect of health and formation. |
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Post by ππ³π°π΅π΄π¬πΊ on Jun 8, 2020 14:30:40 GMT
With the HealthFactor π (1-5,1-6,1-7) the output looks like this: + π²[min - ( (max+ morale ) * π)] unit
+ β * π General
+ Attack Items General
- Defense Items defending general
- 2 * Chevrons defender
- morale * π defender ΒΉβ
--------------------
= #net dmg#
=============
Effective dammage =
Β #net dmg# * EvasionFactor* RestaintFactor * SkillFactorsΒ²
π = HealthFactor (units: 1-5,1-6,1-7 / general: 1-5)
Evasion Factor = (100% - evasion%); with corresponding skill = 100%
Evasion Factor for land troups at sea = 80% with Sailor or Armored Carrier 100%
morale: β¬β¬ =-2 β¬ =-1 normal =0 β¬ =1
1β only if bad defender morale makes this a +bonus
Β² Only if Skills (Spy, Steersmen) are active
Where is my error? Please Erich von Manstein , I'm sorry I need your help again. I know that for rounding there will be probability a slightly difference for the π² (randomized damage) but this should not affect the range. |
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Post by Darth Vader on Jun 8, 2020 15:08:24 GMT
With the HealtFactor π (1-5,1-6,1-7) the output looks like this: + ( π²(min-max) + morale ) * π unit
+ β * π General
+ Attack Items
- Defense Items
- 2 * Chevrons defender
- morale * π defender
--------------------
= #net dmg#
=============
Effective dammage = #net dmg# * EvasionFactor* RestaintFactor
π = HealthFactor (units: 1-5,1-6,1-7 / general: 1-5)
Evasion Factor = (100% - evasion%); with corresponding skill = 100%
Where is my error? Please Erich von Manstein , I'm sorry I need your help again. How does defensive items lower attack? Sure I see how removing a rifle item will lower attack but not for the unit. There are also weird invasion effects when a infantry attacks a fort it does less damage then Artillery. And Calvary does greatly more damage then Artillery to infantry. |
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Post by ππ³π°π΅π΄π¬πΊ on Jun 8, 2020 15:25:21 GMT
How does defensive items lower attack? Sure I see how removing a rifle item will lower attack but not for the unit. There are also weird invasion effects when a infantry attacks a fort it does less damage then Artillery. And Calvary does greatly more damage then Artillery to infantry. Defense Items of the attacked general lower the damage (flat) I will add a commentThe difference in the damage (with equal base) comes from the RestaintFactor different weapons get different multiplier, depending the target. For this reason Grenadiers, MG and Siege for example deal higher damage although their base stat are not (much) higher. |
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Post by Darth Vader on Jun 8, 2020 15:49:04 GMT
How does defensive items lower attack? Sure I see how removing a rifle item will lower attack but not for the unit. There are also weird invasion effects when a infantry attacks a fort it does less damage then Artillery. And Calvary does greatly more damage then Artillery to infantry. Defense Items of the attacked general lower the damage (flat) I will add a commentThe difference in the damage (with equal base) comes from the RestaintFactor different weapons get different multiplier, depending the target. For this reason Grenadiers, MG and Siege for example deal higher damage although their base stat are not (much) higher. It's basically ew6 stats, I see how wearing armor would make it harder to do more damage so I believe that is how it works. |
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Post by Erich von Manstein on Jun 18, 2020 23:35:01 GMT
Hey ππ³π°π΅π΄π¬πΊ, Just took a look at it. Sorry for the long wait. Yeah I feel like you are mostly good, except 2 things I didn't find in your version. The first one is the unit formation, I'm not sure if you merged it with the health factor? The other one is the skill bonus provided by generals, aka Spy and Steersman, which I think should go to the effective damage section. |
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Post by ππ³π°π΅π΄π¬πΊ on Jun 19, 2020 0:45:51 GMT
Hey ππ³π°π΅π΄π¬πΊ, Just took a look at it. Sorry for the long wait. Yeah I feel like you are mostly good, except 2 things I didn't find in your version. The first one is the unit formation, I'm not sure if you merged it with the health factor? The other one is the skill bonus provided by generals, aka Spy and Steersman, which I think should go to the effective damage section. There is no hurry, I hope you was successful! Thank you for your time and review! The section of the effective damage with the multipliers needs Spy (my comment) and a better presentation - if we can live with the NetDmg as an intermediate Value (maybe you have better wordings), I can finish the section with the multipliers more detailed and completed. The formation is always a multiplier of the health factor - please have at a post before with the unic health factor----- quote: ----- So instead of different four health_coefficients tables I just need one table for all. HealthFactor π
Β min. = 1
> Β 5% = 2
> 15% = 3
> 35% = 4
> 50% = 5 maximum for Generals, maximum single formation
> 65% = 6 maximum for double formation
> 80% = 7 maximum, only tripple formation Written like this, I personally understood already much better the effect of health and formation. ----- /quote ----- Damage relevant are higher formations only with good health >65% Yes this is the point where the formation is merged (I would like to have your English skill) - and can disappear in the calculation as faktor. |
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Post by littlecorporal on Jun 19, 2020 1:28:22 GMT
The snare drum then becomes super important for all of your double and triple formation units. Without it, their bonus is extremely dependent on health.
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Post by littlecorporal on Jun 19, 2020 1:31:28 GMT
The health color should be the relevant indicator before attack, corrrect?
Bright Green 80%+
Yellow Green 60%
Yellow 40%
Orange 20%
Red less than 20%
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Post by ππ³π°π΅π΄π¬πΊ on Jun 19, 2020 2:04:50 GMT
The snare drum then becomes super important for all of your double and triple formation units. Without it, their bonus is extremely dependent on health. Very good point! Three snairs the game has - for sure (with buying in the daily shop) - I doubt if four. ----- Edit ----- No doubt anymore! The game has at least four snair drums ! |
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Post by Darth Vader on Jun 19, 2020 2:10:58 GMT
The snare drum then becomes super important for all of your double and triple formation units. Without it, their bonus is extremely dependent on health. Very good point! Three snairs the game has - for sure (with buying in the daily shop) - I doubt if four. It would be cool if you could search what you want and buy it in the shop. |
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Post by littlecorporal on Sept 25, 2020 6:00:28 GMT
I think the creators didnt want people to just to be able to start with the best items. Once you conplete scenarios, you slowly get access to them all.
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Post by sskemperor on Nov 24, 2020 8:32:45 GMT
Erich von Manstein,There is one thing that I cannot understand. For example when a single French Guards(atk 5-9) attack another object with a general. Its damage sometime won't exceed 10. However if I change its atk to 5-5, the damage is stable at 20. Why atk higher, the damage get lower. This makes me confused.
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