Observations about 1939 Western Front Army Group
Dec 26, 2020 21:42:53 GMT
andrei and Nobunaga Oda like this
Post by HangryBird on Dec 26, 2020 21:42:53 GMT
I've attempted 5 army groups: British First Army Group, French Army Group South, Yugoslav Second Army Group, German Army Group B, and Italian Army Group West. With no tech and using only the 4 starting generals, I have won using the latter two. This was surprising, based on the previous easytech games I've played, such as EW6, you'd need some more tech and generals before trying out a conquest (except Netherlands in EW6, that conquest is easy). But then, I noticed that my two victories were done with axis nations. After some thinking, I believe that this army group is skewed toward the Axis powers by a significant margin. Before I go into the reasons why, here is a short summary of what happened in each attempt:
British First Army Group: I quickly landed in the northernmost province that belongs to the Dutch. Germany took it, so I retook it. I pushed heavily into northern Germany, retook Denmark from the Germans, and saved Belgium and the Netherlands. France wasn't doing too badly. They were holding against the Germany and Italians, then they counterattacked into southern Germany. This is where things go wrong. Germany absolutely destroys Poland and while Yugoslavia has Bulgaria on the ropes, they are getting pummeled by Germany, Italy, and Hungary. With no Eastern distraction, the Germans start outproducing me, grinding my advance to a halt. I can't count on reinforcement from my allies: Belgium with 3 corps, each containing six units, cannot advance without taking any French or British territory and the AI doesn't advance into allied territory. I left southern Germany to the French and Belgians, but France proceeded to block the Belgians from taking any German territory, which is why Belgium was just sitting there with 3 full corps. Later, France is getting overwhelmed by the Germans and Italians, who have finished mopping up Yugoslavia. At best, I have a stalemate, since I was only able to knock German Army Group B out of the war.
French Army Group South: I quickly blitz through Italy and knock them out of the war. I start advancing into German Austria and defeat Hungary. I also save Yugoslavia, who defeats Bulgaria and Romania for me. However, Poland still gets destroyed and the Germans blitz through the Danes, Belgians, Dutch, and northern and central France. I quickly assemble an army in southern France to salvage the situation and I barely hold onto this area. Then, the British fall to tons of German naval invasions. It's just me and Yugoslavia against everyone else.
Yugoslav Second Army Group: I quickly defeat Bulgaria and Romania and turn west to face the advancing Italians. I also save Poland, who defeats Czechoslovakia and Hungary for me and they start pushing into eastern Germany. However, just like the previous army group, the West is quickly defeated by Germany. With no Western distraction, the Germans and Italians start outproducing me, grinding my advance to a halt. Poland is getting overwhelmed by the Germans, who launch a nasty counterattack that kicks the Poles back to Warsaw. It's just me and Poland against everyone else.
German Army Group B: I take out the Dutch land territories on turn 1 and the Dutch port on turn 2, quickly destroying them in two turns. I quickly blitz through Denmark and lay siege to Copenhagen. Next, I take Bruxelles on turn 3 and then defend against Petain. While I defend, I heal up my units and wait for Donitz to arrive in the North Atlantic, so I don't have to worry about British naval invasions as I advance into northern France. I take Copenhagen and Donitz finally arrives. I quickly defeat Petain and break through into northern France and take Paris. Donitz goes on a rampage: the British fail to land any troops and Dowding and Montgomery's entire corps goes to the bottom of the ocean. Pound gets pounded into smithereens (Haha, get it). Then, I start taking the French coastal territories, outflanking and encircling French Army Group Center. The Italians finally push the French out of their territory and together, we finish off France. Meanwhile, I send reinforcements to help German Army Group D against Poland. Poland falls as I start landing troops in Britain. Then, Britain and Yugoslavia fall and that's game. S-Rank!
Italian Army Group West: I overrun the French border territories to gain a better position for defending against Darlan and Juin. I send some forces to attack into central France to take some pressure off Germany and to lay siege to Corsica. Once Darlan and Juin are dead, I gobble up southern France and march my troops up to north western France. Germany finally breaks the French lines and together, we capture central France. We also mop up northern France and prepare to invade Britain. I take Corsica and send reinforcements to help Italian Army Group East against Yugoslavia. Britain and Yugoslavia are quickly defeated and Germany finally finishes off Denmark and Poland. That's game. S-Rank!
Based on my attempts, I wondered why I and the AI did better playing axis countries. After all, the Allies and Axis seem to have their own advantages: the Allies have less fronts to focus on and the Axis have better generals. It should all balance out right? Unfortunately, while the Allies appear to be geographically advantaged, it's actually the opposite: the Axis have the geography advantage, which doesn't make sense given their geographic position in IRL.
Point 1: The army group mode is unique in that it splits some countries into multiple parts. So while it appears that only the Axis have to fight a two-front war, this isn't actually true when you consider the individual army groups. Each army group only has one front to fight with the exception of the Polish and Yugoslavian army groups, German Army Group B, and Romania. Both Polish army groups have to fight German Army Group D in the West and Czechoslovakia and Romania in the South. Yugoslav First Army Group has to fight Italian Army Group East in the West and German Army Group D and Hungary in the North. Yugoslav Second Army Group has to fight Bulgaria in the East and Hungary and Romania in the North. German Army Group B has to fight Denmark in the North and Belgium and the Netherlands in the West. Romania has to fight Polish Second Army Group in the North and Yugoslav Second Army Group in the South. So when you consider the individual army groups, the Axis have the advantage of fighting on less fronts.
Point 2: When I started to look at the geographic positions of each individual army group, it became apparent that the Allies had a not so obvious disadvantage. Going back to my attempt as British First Army Group, Belgium couldn't help me or France until it was too late because it got blocked by France. While that was the result of the ai trying advance into a thin corridor in southern Germany, there are army groups who are blocked from the start of the game and all these army groups are in the Allies. Specifically, these army groups are British First Army Group, French Army Group North, and Polish Second Army Group. As mentioned previously, the AI doesn't advance into allied territory. This means British First Army Group can't land troops into Europe until its too late, French Army Group North can't fight at all unless Belgian territory is taken and when that happens, its too late, and Polish Second Army Group can't assist Polish First Army Group against German Army Group D until its too late. In short, these army groups can't contribute in a meaningful way until the axis have taken too much land and start outproducing the Allies. These army groups make up a significant portion of the Allied forces since they are three star, two star, and two star army groups respectively, which makes this disadvantage a huge one. Also, notice how the allies did better when I played one of these "blocked" army groups, British First Army Group.
TLDR: The Axis have better generals and geographic positions, meaning this army group is skewed toward them by a significant margin.
Edit: A minor thing I have noticed about generals is that the Allies have some generals that would be better commanding a different type of unit. For some reason, Darlan is on infantry when he should be on navy and Tassigny is on artillery when he should be on infantry. On the Axis side, the only seemingly questionable decision was putting Horthy on infantry instead of navy, but Horthy at least has Reserve, an infantry skill to make up for it. Also, Hungary doesn't have any coastline, meaning they can't have any naval units at the start of the game, so Horthy being on infantry doesn't bug me as much.
British First Army Group: I quickly landed in the northernmost province that belongs to the Dutch. Germany took it, so I retook it. I pushed heavily into northern Germany, retook Denmark from the Germans, and saved Belgium and the Netherlands. France wasn't doing too badly. They were holding against the Germany and Italians, then they counterattacked into southern Germany. This is where things go wrong. Germany absolutely destroys Poland and while Yugoslavia has Bulgaria on the ropes, they are getting pummeled by Germany, Italy, and Hungary. With no Eastern distraction, the Germans start outproducing me, grinding my advance to a halt. I can't count on reinforcement from my allies: Belgium with 3 corps, each containing six units, cannot advance without taking any French or British territory and the AI doesn't advance into allied territory. I left southern Germany to the French and Belgians, but France proceeded to block the Belgians from taking any German territory, which is why Belgium was just sitting there with 3 full corps. Later, France is getting overwhelmed by the Germans and Italians, who have finished mopping up Yugoslavia. At best, I have a stalemate, since I was only able to knock German Army Group B out of the war.
French Army Group South: I quickly blitz through Italy and knock them out of the war. I start advancing into German Austria and defeat Hungary. I also save Yugoslavia, who defeats Bulgaria and Romania for me. However, Poland still gets destroyed and the Germans blitz through the Danes, Belgians, Dutch, and northern and central France. I quickly assemble an army in southern France to salvage the situation and I barely hold onto this area. Then, the British fall to tons of German naval invasions. It's just me and Yugoslavia against everyone else.
Yugoslav Second Army Group: I quickly defeat Bulgaria and Romania and turn west to face the advancing Italians. I also save Poland, who defeats Czechoslovakia and Hungary for me and they start pushing into eastern Germany. However, just like the previous army group, the West is quickly defeated by Germany. With no Western distraction, the Germans and Italians start outproducing me, grinding my advance to a halt. Poland is getting overwhelmed by the Germans, who launch a nasty counterattack that kicks the Poles back to Warsaw. It's just me and Poland against everyone else.
German Army Group B: I take out the Dutch land territories on turn 1 and the Dutch port on turn 2, quickly destroying them in two turns. I quickly blitz through Denmark and lay siege to Copenhagen. Next, I take Bruxelles on turn 3 and then defend against Petain. While I defend, I heal up my units and wait for Donitz to arrive in the North Atlantic, so I don't have to worry about British naval invasions as I advance into northern France. I take Copenhagen and Donitz finally arrives. I quickly defeat Petain and break through into northern France and take Paris. Donitz goes on a rampage: the British fail to land any troops and Dowding and Montgomery's entire corps goes to the bottom of the ocean. Pound gets pounded into smithereens (Haha, get it). Then, I start taking the French coastal territories, outflanking and encircling French Army Group Center. The Italians finally push the French out of their territory and together, we finish off France. Meanwhile, I send reinforcements to help German Army Group D against Poland. Poland falls as I start landing troops in Britain. Then, Britain and Yugoslavia fall and that's game. S-Rank!
Italian Army Group West: I overrun the French border territories to gain a better position for defending against Darlan and Juin. I send some forces to attack into central France to take some pressure off Germany and to lay siege to Corsica. Once Darlan and Juin are dead, I gobble up southern France and march my troops up to north western France. Germany finally breaks the French lines and together, we capture central France. We also mop up northern France and prepare to invade Britain. I take Corsica and send reinforcements to help Italian Army Group East against Yugoslavia. Britain and Yugoslavia are quickly defeated and Germany finally finishes off Denmark and Poland. That's game. S-Rank!
Based on my attempts, I wondered why I and the AI did better playing axis countries. After all, the Allies and Axis seem to have their own advantages: the Allies have less fronts to focus on and the Axis have better generals. It should all balance out right? Unfortunately, while the Allies appear to be geographically advantaged, it's actually the opposite: the Axis have the geography advantage, which doesn't make sense given their geographic position in IRL.
Point 1: The army group mode is unique in that it splits some countries into multiple parts. So while it appears that only the Axis have to fight a two-front war, this isn't actually true when you consider the individual army groups. Each army group only has one front to fight with the exception of the Polish and Yugoslavian army groups, German Army Group B, and Romania. Both Polish army groups have to fight German Army Group D in the West and Czechoslovakia and Romania in the South. Yugoslav First Army Group has to fight Italian Army Group East in the West and German Army Group D and Hungary in the North. Yugoslav Second Army Group has to fight Bulgaria in the East and Hungary and Romania in the North. German Army Group B has to fight Denmark in the North and Belgium and the Netherlands in the West. Romania has to fight Polish Second Army Group in the North and Yugoslav Second Army Group in the South. So when you consider the individual army groups, the Axis have the advantage of fighting on less fronts.
Point 2: When I started to look at the geographic positions of each individual army group, it became apparent that the Allies had a not so obvious disadvantage. Going back to my attempt as British First Army Group, Belgium couldn't help me or France until it was too late because it got blocked by France. While that was the result of the ai trying advance into a thin corridor in southern Germany, there are army groups who are blocked from the start of the game and all these army groups are in the Allies. Specifically, these army groups are British First Army Group, French Army Group North, and Polish Second Army Group. As mentioned previously, the AI doesn't advance into allied territory. This means British First Army Group can't land troops into Europe until its too late, French Army Group North can't fight at all unless Belgian territory is taken and when that happens, its too late, and Polish Second Army Group can't assist Polish First Army Group against German Army Group D until its too late. In short, these army groups can't contribute in a meaningful way until the axis have taken too much land and start outproducing the Allies. These army groups make up a significant portion of the Allied forces since they are three star, two star, and two star army groups respectively, which makes this disadvantage a huge one. Also, notice how the allies did better when I played one of these "blocked" army groups, British First Army Group.
TLDR: The Axis have better generals and geographic positions, meaning this army group is skewed toward them by a significant margin.
Edit: A minor thing I have noticed about generals is that the Allies have some generals that would be better commanding a different type of unit. For some reason, Darlan is on infantry when he should be on navy and Tassigny is on artillery when he should be on infantry. On the Axis side, the only seemingly questionable decision was putting Horthy on infantry instead of navy, but Horthy at least has Reserve, an infantry skill to make up for it. Also, Hungary doesn't have any coastline, meaning they can't have any naval units at the start of the game, so Horthy being on infantry doesn't bug me as much.
