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Post by Inactive user on Sept 24, 2021 19:07:46 GMT
They were not as well known and as important as the two possible candidates I listed, meaning they'd have a much harder time bzcoming the leader of a newly formed nation. Well, the biggest role of all after Lenin most probably belongs to Trotski. Stalin did not make that significant of a contribution in the revolution and hadn't really been popular. In fact when he was exiled in Siberia before the revolution, Lenin once asked his comrades "can you tell me Koba's (Stalin's nickname) real name" and his comrades couldn't answer. Now back to the original topic, I believe that for example Grigori Zinovjev was a great candidate. Irl he and Kamenev opposed Lenin's proposal for the revolution, which would affect their reputation negatively, but we are talking about an alternative timeline so things could have been different. Also if Trotsky wouldn't have been there with such an important role, Stalin would have had a much harder time getting rid of Zinovjev and friends, because irl he allied with them to destroy the left wing, which helped him gain power and annihilate Zinovjev, Kamenev, Kalinin, Tomski, Rykov and Buharin. Hmm, you have a point. You do need to note though that everything i listed is still mostly the same as in our timeline, as i would have no way to say what would really happen after the "nexus-event". Also, this is why i said Trotsky would be a mich better candidate than Stalin. I still list Stalin rhough, as even when he wasn't popular, he still managed to gain power anyway. |
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Post by Inactive user on Sept 24, 2021 19:09:24 GMT
Anway gtg now, if you want i'll continue rhis discussion tomorrow which is in about 12-13 hours  |
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Post by Kliment Jefremovitš Vorošilov on Sept 24, 2021 19:11:07 GMT
Anway gtg now, if you want i'll continue rhis discussion tomorrow which is in about 12-13 hours Yeah, same, if you were talking to me. |
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Post by Kliment Jefremovitš Vorošilov on Sept 24, 2021 19:13:25 GMT
Well, the biggest role of all after Lenin most probably belongs to Trotski. Stalin did not make that significant of a contribution in the revolution and hadn't really been popular. In fact when he was exiled in Siberia before the revolution, Lenin once asked his comrades "can you tell me Koba's (Stalin's nickname) real name" and his comrades couldn't answer. Now back to the original topic, I believe that for example Grigori Zinovjev was a great candidate. Irl he and Kamenev opposed Lenin's proposal for the revolution, which would affect their reputation negatively, but we are talking about an alternative timeline so things could have been different. Also if Trotsky wouldn't have been there with such an important role, Stalin would have had a much harder time getting rid of Zinovjev and friends, because irl he allied with them to destroy the left wing, which helped him gain power and annihilate Zinovjev, Kamenev, Kalinin, Tomski, Rykov and Buharin. Hmm, you have a point. You do need to note though that everything i listed is still mostly the same as in our timeline, as i would have no way to say what would really happen after the "nexus-event". Also, this is why i said Trotsky would be a mich better candidate than Stalin. I still list Stalin rhough, as even when he wasn't popular, he still managed to gain power anyway. Yeah, Stalin definitely was "dictator type", but he couldn't have become one without the right conditions, but that's only speculation. But anyways unrelated to the discussion I firmly believe that Stalin wouldn't had risen to power without Trotski. |
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Post by Manfred von Richthofen on Sept 25, 2021 1:51:18 GMT
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Post by Inactive user on Sept 25, 2021 9:15:31 GMT
Hmm, you have a point. You do need to note though that everything i listed is still mostly the same as in our timeline, as i would have no way to say what would really happen after the "nexus-event". Also, this is why i said Trotsky would be a mich better candidate than Stalin. I still list Stalin rhough, as even when he wasn't popular, he still managed to gain power anyway. Yeah, Stalin definitely was "dictator type", but he couldn't have become one without the right conditions, but that's only speculation. But anyways unrelated to the discussion I firmly believe that Stalin wouldn't had risen to power without Trotski. What you're saying is absolutely true, but what are the right conditions? Stalin became a dictator pretty much due to his position in the party, which held great power, meaning he could rise the ranks very quickly. |
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Post by Inactive user on Sept 25, 2021 9:15:47 GMT
Yup!  first try even |
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Post by Kliment Jefremovitš Vorošilov on Sept 25, 2021 11:36:11 GMT
Yeah, Stalin definitely was "dictator type", but he couldn't have become one without the right conditions, but that's only speculation. But anyways unrelated to the discussion I firmly believe that Stalin wouldn't had risen to power without Trotski. What you're saying is absolutely true, but what are the right conditions? Stalin became a dictator pretty much due to his position in the party, which held great power, meaning he could rise the ranks very quickly. Trltski had even bigger power in the party, so it's not only that. The battle against Trotski's left wing in the Bolševik party helped him gain power over other right wingers and the NKVD and other vital structures of the party. Stalin got his hands on the ingredients of his terrifying terror. Because of this many decided that it's better to ally with Stalin, and to get betrayed later on. Everyone had to choose either to oppose Stalin and risk being arrested or just quietly join him. |
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Post by Inactive user on Sept 25, 2021 14:45:59 GMT
What you're saying is absolutely true, but what are the right conditions? Stalin became a dictator pretty much due to his position in the party, which held great power, meaning he could rise the ranks very quickly. Trltski had even bigger power in the party, so it's not only that. The battle against Trotski's left wing in the Bolševik party helped him gain power over other right wingers and the NKVD and other vital structures of the party. Stalin got his hands on the ingredients of his terrifying terror. Because of this many decided that it's better to ally with Stalin, and to get betrayed later on. Everyone had to choose either to oppose Stalin and risk being arrested or just quietly join him. Hmm. It aints hard to decide the right answer then But i shouldn't laught with this. Many people suffered under his rule  |
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Post by Kliment Jefremovitš Vorošilov on Sept 25, 2021 15:02:36 GMT
Trltski had even bigger power in the party, so it's not only that. The battle against Trotski's left wing in the Bolševik party helped him gain power over other right wingers and the NKVD and other vital structures of the party. Stalin got his hands on the ingredients of his terrifying terror. Because of this many decided that it's better to ally with Stalin, and to get betrayed later on. Everyone had to choose either to oppose Stalin and risk being arrested or just quietly join him. Hmm. It aints hard to decide the right answer then But i shouldn't laught with this. Many people suffered under his rule Yeah, Stalin caused unimaginable human suffering. A violent father, sell punishment in school, extreme paranoia and inability to feel empathy except a very small amount of close people is not a good combo. |
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Post by Manfred von Richthofen on Sept 26, 2021 1:03:41 GMT
Yup! first try even Took me 4 tries to pass. |
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Post by Captain on Oct 19, 2021 9:07:15 GMT
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Post by Gerd von Rundstedt on Oct 19, 2021 17:42:53 GMT
Okay, what is your specialty?
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Post by Manfred von Richthofen on Oct 20, 2021 5:26:35 GMT
Okay, what is your specialty? I want keep learning (new things)😄 he means what time period are you great at |
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Post by Captain on Oct 20, 2021 5:44:54 GMT
I want keep learning (new things)😄 he means what time period are you great at Oh.. 😳😳 In modern history (such as ww2 1939-1945) |
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first try even
