Post by ππ³π°π΅π΄π¬πΊ on Jan 25, 2021 15:53:37 GMT
Tactical guide
βπΌ 25Jan20
wπ§π§π§ under construction π§π§π§
Sorry I first had to copy different segments here - this is still not ready
π§ work in progress π§
A collection of different tactics.
I try to group and organize all tactics that we are collecting, so later we can compile all this knowledge to a Tactical guide / questionare in complementary to this nice Strategic Staff work:...
This guide bases on our discussion in pathdoc's Questions to ask at the start of the battle
Thank you littlecorporal for your initiative, and thank you pathdoc and Nobunaga for every single aspect - here I start (late) the compilationπ§
let's try to collect all tactics we use.
... continuing ...
littlecorporal said:I have been thinking that there are many threads about strategy but not really that many about tactics. Is it because tactics are a lot harder to explain or are they too easy or to dependant on your generals?
If I understand you correct - tactics is how you plan and execute single fights and strategy is how you organize a mission or conquest over all - right?
A real thread about this I'm missing too. I shared already a few tactics with @, In his guidancees on campaign-trail requests if an user needs help, he explained a lot of tactics.
I am very interested to optimize my fighting and to share the tactics.
And yes, I think it is sometimes difficult to explain - it needs first one time a structure:
Tactics - battle specific
[/ul]
for all fights:
If you need to distract the enemy and have the ability to do so, build a fort.
If you want to attack, use your arty and ranged navy, if applicable, first. Follow up with inf and end with cav. However, given that not all situations may allow for this, attack with your own discretion.
Flanking
. I always try to concentrate on flanked troops, failing that, never go against troops with higher morale, except in some cases, like vs. artillery.
Attacking enemy generals, it's important to check their Nobility first. If it's +10 in a city, you need to do lots of damage every round
Tactics, Forts :
As you pointed out: building small forts is the most effective (damage absorbing) defensive tactic. For 120π°10π§ you can reduce up to 160HP from attacking enemies. (maximum 1 fort per round).
- Build them strategical:
1. a fort in front of a bridge prevents the enemy from passing the river! - you will win 2-4 rounds - on blitz missions this can be enough to finish before the big attack and the problems begin.
2. A fort in construction flanks! Use them also for flanking:
a) Pass with your solitaire unit the enemy, general to your best attacking hex (evasion is your bonus)
B) build the fort on your path to flank the enemy
c) now you can attack! (+[5-7] Atk, counterattack -[turn++)
d) the enemy AI will attack the construction - not your general, on their turn
Tactics: Attack order
For a efective massive attack, the attack order is very important!
The order depends on
A the enemy:
1. Remaining Hp
2. Skill / items
3. Unit
4. Danger (how much damage will his counterattack cause)
5. Dob you want to occupy his hex?
B your troops. (And your personal style)
Flank first! This is very important especially when attack with multiple units in a row - you will have multiple bonus DMG
Nobunaga Oda said: 1.Cannon/Rocket 2.Inf 3.Cav. This is the common attack order I know, it works for many playstyles.
Let's collect the different aspects (like checklist)
My points:
- If I want to occupy the blocked hex , I select one flanking unit which I will only use on the enemies death, to conquer it.
- If my cavalry will probably survive, against Inf + Art I attack as first with my Light Cavalry spam and my cav generals - (only) with charge the enemy can get confused, for this reason I start! with cav.
But:
- Cavalry that hasn't moved will attack at the end !
- Against C and I the bobbardement should be in the beginning that's clear.
- With strong generals, that have a good advantage, I attack in the beginning.
- My artillery only attacks targets that can't counterattack! But they provocate to get attacked by forts and artillery - this is very healthy - and keeps good mood
- I don't attack with units on bad morale or less than β health
On a massive attack I use all troops that economic can deal a few DMG.
NO general can survive 3 rounds - I even don't have one present who survived the second attack.
Flanking and a massive (mortal) attack - with 5movement (Isabella and Sophia only 4hex) I jump in missions from objective to objective - this is strategy.
I am very interested to learn other tactics, and your comments
How many attacks are necessary?
I can't prove it too - I notice in missions - some enemies seem to need a certain number of attacks - many city defending grenadiers (135) seems not to surrender with two attacks (from generals β 100max DMG)... The moment S/L can help, but only after many many tries - or one small extra hit of 4HP and suddenly you can't loose this fight.
For now, I can't prove it - but not only once I had this feeling.
Conquer cities:
Another tactic I like, seize the facility with a very weak unit and then have it commit suicide by attacking the strongest enemy. You can then build a new unit in the facility capable of withstanding the next attack.
Trotsky , when using the rockets, you have to be careful because the rocket strike hits in the target hex and also the next one over. So the flanking units to demoralize it should ideally be above and below. If you have a very weak flanking unit to the left or right, you can occasionally destroy it by accident.
On the other hand, it does mean you can take advantage of this to do minor damage to an enemy three hexes away, IF there is another enemy two hexes away to act as a main target.
HOWEVER, You are very right about thinking about the attack if you need to occupy the hex. This is ESPECIALLY IMPORTANT if it's an important capture like a Level 7 city (e.g. for the Lan or Victoria rush) and there are allies nearby who might steal the city from you. In those circumstances it might be better not to attack with all your units; leave him with a bit of health so he can survive the attack of the AI allies, and then you can take it next turn. Waiting one more turn is better than losing it.
In addition, because rockets are immune from retaliation fire, if you have a very strong artillery general with strong artillery items (especially one with the Spy skill, like Sophia) you can sometimes one-shot forts and coastal artillery. e.g. give 5-star Sophia +6 powder and the boat, and she will smash them at full efficiency or make them so weak that you can finish them off with frigates or battleships without taking much damage
said:Another tactic I like, seize the facility with a very weak unit and then have it commit suicide by attacking the strongest enemy. You can then build a new unit in the facility capable of withstanding the next attack.
Tactics: Conquering
I use the Harakiri tactics too. Wikipedia says the correct vocabulary is Seppuku (Harakiri)
A very useful tactic, esspecial after a heavy fight, when my troops are not on full health.
Not to give the enemy the opputunity to build new units in an untilliy under siege, leads to pathdoc's tactical advice:
HOWEVER, You are very rightp about thinking about the attack if you need to occupy the hex. This is ESPECIALLY IMPORTANT if it's an important capture like a Level 7 city (e.g. for the Lan or Victoria rush) and there are allies nearby who might steal the city from you. In those circumstances it might be better not to attack with all your units; leave him with a bit of health so he can survive the attack of the AI allies, and then you can take it next turn. Waiting one more turn is better than losing it.
I want to add one more aspect to this decisioning:
For not to making unwanted mistakes when conquering cities, it is helpful to analyze the turn order: If your Allied has his turn before the enemy, they will occupy the undefended hex if possible. This can be unwanted in conquests and useful in campaign: In the campaign my allies finished a few missions for me, by occupying the last undefended objective during their turn (same round!)
than losing it.
I want to add one more aspect to this decisioning:
For not to making unwanted mistakes when conquering cities, it is helpful to analyze the turn order: If your Allied has his turn before the enemy, they will occupy the undefended hex if possible. This can be unwanted in conquests and useful in campaign: In the campaign my allies finished a few missions for me, by occupying the last undefended objective during their turn (same round!)
Notes: I think the AI will react this way: - normal defending units won't leave their base on low health
- If AI has enough resources, a defending general will leave an utility on low health and build direct a fresh defender.
Comments and additions are welcome!..
Tactics: Fighting with rockets
Rockets are the unique unit-type that can harm two units with one single attack - attention: they can cause Friendly Fire (you can harm your own troups) Rockets will not recieve a counterattack and they can't fight back. Rockets require specific tactics to be used.
One thing in front: Rockets can deal very painful damage to your enemy, but they can't counterattack - your rockets are the primary target of the AI. Every enemy that has the possibility, will attack them immediately. Conclusion: Rockets are the perfect unit to start a deadly (massive) attack. I need to add extra notes in the MA -section
Be aware of their weakness and take care of them, rocets have also some great unique advantages:
pathdoc said:[ ... ] you can take advantage of this to do minor damage to an enemy three hexes away, IF there is another enemy two hexes away to act as a main target.
Because rockets are immune from retaliation fire, if you have a very strong artillery general with strong artillery items (especially one with the Spy skill, like Sophia) you can sometimes one-shot forts and coastal artillery. e.g. give 5-star Sophia +6 powder and the boat, and she will smash them at full efficiency or make them so weak that you can finish them off with frigates or battleships without taking much damage.
City-defending units without general usually won't attack your troops, except units can't fight back! For siege and rockets the hex around a hostile city are NOT safe!
Rockets harm additional the more distant hex west or east of your target. When firing from the south, the rockets seem to drop to the right (east); when firing from the north, they drop to the left (west).
For discussion:
Rockets can cause lowerering morale like a charge of cavalry - my questions:
- I have the impression the probability is significant lower than the chance of a cavalry charge ?
- does this work for cavalry units too? Cavalry is immune to a cav-charge but can a rocket attack lower the morale of cavalry
Ships
Flank / surround and destroy, just like you would during land battles.
Otherwise, when fighting privateers, treat your ships and attack from afar, unless you too are using privateers.
When confronting coastal forts:
- Swarm them, especially when they are weakened.
- Avoid 1V1 battles, especially if they have a morale boost.
- Best to use land units, especially arty to attack.
When you need to hold a port under threat and your budget is tight, use a privateer.
Otherwise, spam frigates. Their speed and relatively good output are their best traits.
-- Comment -- Attention Expensive !
Artillery
Don't attack forts or artillery directly
Cavalry
slash to go
medikits after battle stg
Infantry
spam
units for purposes
It is irritating how I wrote it - I just mentioned the Siege because: City defending groups without general usually don't attack your groups on the hex next to the city - But they will attack rockets on these hexes. [and Siege]
I think I better don't mention the Siege in the Rocket tactics.
Edit: I will cut the whole paragraph out - I mention before that everyone will attack the rockets
Ai tactics.
Knowing AI tactics:
AI don't know morale.
If AI is in risk of food shortage AI builds non-consuming forts.
AI builds costal forts only at the coast
βπΌ 25Jan20
wπ§π§π§ under construction π§π§π§
Sorry I first had to copy different segments here - this is still not ready
π§ work in progress π§
A collection of different tactics.
I try to group and organize all tactics that we are collecting, so later we can compile all this knowledge to a Tactical guide / questionare in complementary to this nice Strategic Staff work:...
This guide bases on our discussion in pathdoc's Questions to ask at the start of the battle
Thank you littlecorporal for your initiative, and thank you pathdoc and Nobunaga for every single aspect - here I start (late) the compilationπ§
let's try to collect all tactics we use.
... continuing ...
littlecorporal said:I have been thinking that there are many threads about strategy but not really that many about tactics. Is it because tactics are a lot harder to explain or are they too easy or to dependant on your generals?
If I understand you correct - tactics is how you plan and execute single fights and strategy is how you organize a mission or conquest over all - right?
A real thread about this I'm missing too. I shared already a few tactics with @, In his guidancees on campaign-trail requests if an user needs help, he explained a lot of tactics.
I am very interested to optimize my fighting and to share the tactics.
And yes, I think it is sometimes difficult to explain - it needs first one time a structure:
Tactics - battle specific
overview
- For all fights
- Flanking & morale
- Attack order
- Conquering
- Unit specific
- Forts
- Artillery
- ββRockets
- Cavalary
- ββAC
- Infantry
- Navy
for all fights:
If you need to distract the enemy and have the ability to do so, build a fort.
If you want to attack, use your arty and ranged navy, if applicable, first. Follow up with inf and end with cav. However, given that not all situations may allow for this, attack with your own discretion.
Flanking
. I always try to concentrate on flanked troops, failing that, never go against troops with higher morale, except in some cases, like vs. artillery.
Attacking enemy generals, it's important to check their Nobility first. If it's +10 in a city, you need to do lots of damage every round
Tactics, Forts :
As you pointed out: building small forts is the most effective (damage absorbing) defensive tactic. For 120π°10π§ you can reduce up to 160HP from attacking enemies. (maximum 1 fort per round).
- Build them strategical:
1. a fort in front of a bridge prevents the enemy from passing the river! - you will win 2-4 rounds - on blitz missions this can be enough to finish before the big attack and the problems begin.
2. A fort in construction flanks! Use them also for flanking:
a) Pass with your solitaire unit the enemy, general to your best attacking hex (evasion is your bonus)
B) build the fort on your path to flank the enemy
c) now you can attack! (+[5-7] Atk, counterattack -[turn++)
d) the enemy AI will attack the construction - not your general, on their turn
Tactics: Attack order
For a efective massive attack, the attack order is very important!
The order depends on
A the enemy:
1. Remaining Hp
2. Skill / items
3. Unit
4. Danger (how much damage will his counterattack cause)
5. Dob you want to occupy his hex?
B your troops. (And your personal style)
Flank first! This is very important especially when attack with multiple units in a row - you will have multiple bonus DMG
Nobunaga Oda said: 1.Cannon/Rocket 2.Inf 3.Cav. This is the common attack order I know, it works for many playstyles.
Let's collect the different aspects (like checklist)
My points:
- If I want to occupy the blocked hex , I select one flanking unit which I will only use on the enemies death, to conquer it.
- If my cavalry will probably survive, against Inf + Art I attack as first with my Light Cavalry spam and my cav generals - (only) with charge the enemy can get confused, for this reason I start! with cav.
But:
- Cavalry that hasn't moved will attack at the end !
- Against C and I the bobbardement should be in the beginning that's clear.
- With strong generals, that have a good advantage, I attack in the beginning.
- My artillery only attacks targets that can't counterattack! But they provocate to get attacked by forts and artillery - this is very healthy - and keeps good mood
- I don't attack with units on bad morale or less than β health
On a massive attack I use all troops that economic can deal a few DMG.
NO general can survive 3 rounds - I even don't have one present who survived the second attack.
Flanking and a massive (mortal) attack - with 5movement (Isabella and Sophia only 4hex) I jump in missions from objective to objective - this is strategy.
I am very interested to learn other tactics, and your comments
How many attacks are necessary?
I can't prove it too - I notice in missions - some enemies seem to need a certain number of attacks - many city defending grenadiers (135) seems not to surrender with two attacks (from generals β 100max DMG)... The moment S/L can help, but only after many many tries - or one small extra hit of 4HP and suddenly you can't loose this fight.
For now, I can't prove it - but not only once I had this feeling.
Conquer cities:
Another tactic I like, seize the facility with a very weak unit and then have it commit suicide by attacking the strongest enemy. You can then build a new unit in the facility capable of withstanding the next attack.
Trotsky , when using the rockets, you have to be careful because the rocket strike hits in the target hex and also the next one over. So the flanking units to demoralize it should ideally be above and below. If you have a very weak flanking unit to the left or right, you can occasionally destroy it by accident.
On the other hand, it does mean you can take advantage of this to do minor damage to an enemy three hexes away, IF there is another enemy two hexes away to act as a main target.
HOWEVER, You are very right about thinking about the attack if you need to occupy the hex. This is ESPECIALLY IMPORTANT if it's an important capture like a Level 7 city (e.g. for the Lan or Victoria rush) and there are allies nearby who might steal the city from you. In those circumstances it might be better not to attack with all your units; leave him with a bit of health so he can survive the attack of the AI allies, and then you can take it next turn. Waiting one more turn is better than losing it.
In addition, because rockets are immune from retaliation fire, if you have a very strong artillery general with strong artillery items (especially one with the Spy skill, like Sophia) you can sometimes one-shot forts and coastal artillery. e.g. give 5-star Sophia +6 powder and the boat, and she will smash them at full efficiency or make them so weak that you can finish them off with frigates or battleships without taking much damage
said:Another tactic I like, seize the facility with a very weak unit and then have it commit suicide by attacking the strongest enemy. You can then build a new unit in the facility capable of withstanding the next attack.
Tactics: Conquering
I use the Harakiri tactics too. Wikipedia says the correct vocabulary is Seppuku (Harakiri)
A very useful tactic, esspecial after a heavy fight, when my troops are not on full health.
Not to give the enemy the opputunity to build new units in an untilliy under siege, leads to pathdoc's tactical advice:
HOWEVER, You are very rightp about thinking about the attack if you need to occupy the hex. This is ESPECIALLY IMPORTANT if it's an important capture like a Level 7 city (e.g. for the Lan or Victoria rush) and there are allies nearby who might steal the city from you. In those circumstances it might be better not to attack with all your units; leave him with a bit of health so he can survive the attack of the AI allies, and then you can take it next turn. Waiting one more turn is better than losing it.
I want to add one more aspect to this decisioning:
For not to making unwanted mistakes when conquering cities, it is helpful to analyze the turn order: If your Allied has his turn before the enemy, they will occupy the undefended hex if possible. This can be unwanted in conquests and useful in campaign: In the campaign my allies finished a few missions for me, by occupying the last undefended objective during their turn (same round!)
than losing it.
I want to add one more aspect to this decisioning:
For not to making unwanted mistakes when conquering cities, it is helpful to analyze the turn order: If your Allied has his turn before the enemy, they will occupy the undefended hex if possible. This can be unwanted in conquests and useful in campaign: In the campaign my allies finished a few missions for me, by occupying the last undefended objective during their turn (same round!)
Notes: I think the AI will react this way: - normal defending units won't leave their base on low health
- If AI has enough resources, a defending general will leave an utility on low health and build direct a fresh defender.
Comments and additions are welcome!..
Tactics: Fighting with rockets
Rockets are the unique unit-type that can harm two units with one single attack - attention: they can cause Friendly Fire (you can harm your own troups) Rockets will not recieve a counterattack and they can't fight back. Rockets require specific tactics to be used.
One thing in front: Rockets can deal very painful damage to your enemy, but they can't counterattack - your rockets are the primary target of the AI. Every enemy that has the possibility, will attack them immediately. Conclusion: Rockets are the perfect unit to start a deadly (massive) attack. I need to add extra notes in the MA -section
Be aware of their weakness and take care of them, rocets have also some great unique advantages:
pathdoc said:[ ... ] you can take advantage of this to do minor damage to an enemy three hexes away, IF there is another enemy two hexes away to act as a main target.
Because rockets are immune from retaliation fire, if you have a very strong artillery general with strong artillery items (especially one with the Spy skill, like Sophia) you can sometimes one-shot forts and coastal artillery. e.g. give 5-star Sophia +6 powder and the boat, and she will smash them at full efficiency or make them so weak that you can finish them off with frigates or battleships without taking much damage.
City-defending units without general usually won't attack your troops, except units can't fight back! For siege and rockets the hex around a hostile city are NOT safe!
Rockets harm additional the more distant hex west or east of your target. When firing from the south, the rockets seem to drop to the right (east); when firing from the north, they drop to the left (west).
For discussion:
Rockets can cause lowerering morale like a charge of cavalry - my questions:
- I have the impression the probability is significant lower than the chance of a cavalry charge ?
- does this work for cavalry units too? Cavalry is immune to a cav-charge but can a rocket attack lower the morale of cavalry
Ships
Flank / surround and destroy, just like you would during land battles.
Otherwise, when fighting privateers, treat your ships and attack from afar, unless you too are using privateers.
When confronting coastal forts:
- Swarm them, especially when they are weakened.
- Avoid 1V1 battles, especially if they have a morale boost.
- Best to use land units, especially arty to attack.
When you need to hold a port under threat and your budget is tight, use a privateer.
Otherwise, spam frigates. Their speed and relatively good output are their best traits.
-- Comment -- Attention Expensive !
Artillery
Don't attack forts or artillery directly
Cavalry
slash to go
medikits after battle stg
Infantry
spam
units for purposes
It is irritating how I wrote it - I just mentioned the Siege because: City defending groups without general usually don't attack your groups on the hex next to the city - But they will attack rockets on these hexes. [and Siege]
I think I better don't mention the Siege in the Rocket tactics.
Edit: I will cut the whole paragraph out - I mention before that everyone will attack the rockets
Ai tactics.
Knowing AI tactics:
AI don't know morale.
If AI is in risk of food shortage AI builds non-consuming forts.
AI builds costal forts only at the coast