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Post by nikomachos on Dec 24, 2023 0:49:58 GMT
Theron i do plan to respond eventually but didnt find the time now around christmas  |
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Post by Theron of Acragas on Dec 24, 2023 5:58:16 GMT
Theron i do plan to respond eventually but didnt find the time now around christmas No problem, merry Christmas to you and Eugene V. Debs (I do intend to respond to your last post eventually). |
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Post by Eugene V. Debs on Dec 24, 2023 6:49:42 GMT
Theron i do plan to respond eventually but didnt find the time now around christmas No problem, merry Christmas to you and Eugene V. Debs (I do intend to respond to your last post eventually). Merry Christmas to you both, and to everybody else as well! And now, my favourite time of the year has finally come... well, except the weather |
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Post by Nobunaga Oda on Dec 31, 2023 16:26:31 GMT
Welcome to 2024, for those whose timezones have crossed it.
Wishing all a wonderful new year.
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Post by Theron of Acragas on Dec 31, 2023 19:20:57 GMT
Happy new year to those east of Ural, happy approaching new year (sorry, don't know if there's an English equivalent of how we say it) to everyone else 😀
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Post by blueberry on Dec 31, 2023 23:50:11 GMT
Happy new year to the whole forum!
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Post by Eugene V. Debs on Jan 1, 2024 7:38:23 GMT
Happy new year to everybody!
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Post by Theron of Acragas on Jan 8, 2024 16:35:53 GMT
You are raising pretty good questions, some of which I don't think I'm qualified enough to respond to, given that I'm still doing readings on ethics. I'll still try to answer, but my responses might fall a bit short, so sorry in advance  On a more positive note, it's actually surprising how much we seem to agree lol. I'd like to believe I would. There were many groups who opposed it, and given my current leanings, I'd hopefully be one of them if I was alive back then. Furthermore, while there might not be a pre-determined morality, as humans we have still developed a sense of one together with out evolution. And it still keeps evolving every day, like the human race. And while it might be artificial, this doesn't make it any less valid. For example, our emotions are caused by chemicals in our brains, and many human actions are at least affected by existing material conditions. Does this make them any less valid? Of course not. I personally believe that life has no inherent meaning, which gives us the liberty to choose our own purpose. So, why not make the most out of it and help others live their lives to the fullest too? Personally, that's what makes me keep living despite everything, and where my sense of morality comes from. From materialism, a historical analysis and a pragmatic calculation, instead of idealism and a separate morality isolated from our material reality (not that the latter is necessarily bad, of course. To each their own.). Moreover, on the contrary, I'd say that one isn't genuinely good if they need an external incentive, like religions, to become good. While it's certainly fine if that helps one to become a good person (hence I respect religion even though I'm an atheist myself), there are many good non-theist people as well, which means that one doesn't need anything to be good, except from the act of being good itself. We aren't inherently good or bad, but rather, our initial personality is determined by the socio-economic system and the environment we live in. As proven by science, consciousness exists within and together with the confines of material reality, not separate from or above it, which means that we are limited to material conditions we live in: if you lived among evil people all your life, it's unlikely you even know what goodness means. If the system you live in rewards greed, you're more likely to be greedy, as you have no option but to be greedy in order to climb the ladder, like our modern society. The counter example is many different cultures that existed throughout history, which rewarded compassion and cooperation instead: hence we won the game of evolution and survival against other animals despite our physical disadvantages. Or if you're born in a Christian family, you'll likely stay as one unless you experience a life-changing event. We are limited to the reality we live in, and the socio-economic system by extension. That being said, while material conditions guide our actions and they cannot exist seperately, we still hold the final say in the end. We still have some degree of free will imo. That's why life is worth living, and goodness is worth fighting for. Edit: Btw, here's another quote then, this time from Doctor Who. As cheesy as it may sound, I feel like it perfectly summarises my view on morality: "Hey! I'm going to be dead in a few hours, so before I go, let's have this out. You and me, once and for all. Winning? Is that what you think it’s about? I’m not trying to win. I'm not doing this because I want to beat someone — or because I hate someone, or because I want to blame someone. It’s not because it’s fun. God knows it’s not because it's easy. It’s not even because it works, because it hardly ever does. I do what I do because it's right! Because it's decent! And above all, it's kind! It's just that. Just kind. If I run away today, good people will die. If I stand and fight, some of them might live — maybe not many, maybe not for long. Hey, maybe there’s no point in any of this at all, but it's the best I can do. So I'm going to do it, and I will stand here doing it until it kills me. You're going to die, too, someday. When will that be? Have you thought about it? What would you die for? Who I am is where I stand. Where I stand is where I fall. Stand with me. These people are terrified. Maybe we can help a little. Why not, just at the end, just be kind?" Sorry it's been a while, but I promised you a response 😁 I've been having a hard time organizing my own thoughts, but it seems to me that you've taken an inherently contradictory position. If life has no inherent meaning, and we and our emotions are just a bunch of chemicals, then I'd argue that it follows that life has no inherent value. That being the case, what does it matter how I affect another bunch of chemicals? Why is helping others morally superior, if they have no inherent meaning/value? In short, if life has no inherent meaning, how is "good" even a meaningful concept? Morality in this case isn't a measure of "good" and "bad" - it's simply a set of rules that helps us to function and interact with each other, and in that case it can be freely disregarded whenever it's convenient. However, this does not seem to be your approach to morality. In fact, given the quote you cited, it seems that you believe in doing the morally right thing, even when it isn't convenient or easy, which is why I say your position is inconsistent. Why is that? I'd posit that, if there is an absolute morality, then it follows that people are inherently aware of it to some degree. Assuming you're a decent person and don't simply reject or ignore it, you have to explain it within your worldview, but the fact doesn't change. In other words, returning to the example with slavery, if you lived at the time you would after all support abolition, because, even while you reject absolute morality, you are aware that slavery is inherently wrong (although, if life has no inherent meaning, there's no reason that should be the case). Responding to some of your other comments: "I'd say that one isn't genuinely good if they need an external incentive, like religions, to become good" - incidentally, Christian theology, at least, has no problem with this position. "there are many good non-theist people as well, which means that one doesn't need anything to be good, except from the act of being good itself" - this is where there's room for discussion. First of all, the claim depends on your definition of "good", which I'm arguing is already standing on very shaky ground. Second, I'd submit that many non-theists (and also many theists) do actions that we'd agree are good, either to earn recognition from others or to feel good about themselves, which are inherently selfish motives. If one does good, not because it is good, but for reasons that are selfish or otherwise not good, are they truly a good person? "As proven by science, consciousness exists within and together with the confines of material reality, not separate from or above it" - to be honest, I'm not entirely clear as to what this means, or how it's even testable by science. However I probably agree more than disagree with your conclusions. I guess I give a bit more weight than you do to human nature. While different cultures no doubt have different strengths and flaws, people, in the broadest terms, are much the same everywhere. Specifically, people in any culture tend to be selfish and greedy (though it may be demonstrated in different ways), no matter the culture and economic system. Anecdotal, I know, but I've lived in currently very socialist and in post-Soviet countries, and greed is no less a reality than in capitalist societies - if anything, more so. This, incidentally, is related to why I'm a capitalist, but that's a topic for another post) Regarding the second part of your post, I have some thoughts but we might be on thin ice, so I'll take it to Discord if you want. |
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Post by Jeanne d'Arc on Jan 28, 2024 16:01:22 GMT
OK, so something funny popped up while I was strolling around in the "game modifications" board.
I don't know if this has happened to anyone else, but it went something along the lines of:
"HEY, YOU! You're registered, and you've been looking at, like, 51 threads, but you haven't posted since May 9, 2021. ****in' SAY SOMETHING! Seriously, we'd love to hear yer voice again."
Somehow I have the feeling that, even though I got the numbers right on that post, I had the phrasing completely wrong.
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Post by Nobunaga Oda on Feb 7, 2024 16:54:45 GMT
 Random glitch from EW7 from some Conquest a long time ago. No picture icon for the tile and the obvious land tile is incorrectly registered. Might be the Fall of Constantinople conquest. |
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Post by Gerd von Rundstedt on Feb 22, 2024 2:18:05 GMT
OK, so something funny popped up while I was strolling around in the "game modifications" board. I don't know if this has happened to anyone else, but it went something along the lines of: "HEY, YOU! You're registered, and you've been looking at, like, 51 threads, but you haven't posted since May 9, 2021. ****in' SAY SOMETHING! Seriously, we'd love to hear yer voice again." Somehow I have the feeling that, even though I got the numbers right on that post, I had the phrasing completely wrong. Holy cow, it's you. Nice seeing a friendly face every so often. |
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Post by Just One Bite on Feb 28, 2024 13:06:36 GMT
I never thought I would see World Conqueror 4 outside of WC4 forums.  |
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Post by Airi Momoi on Feb 28, 2024 15:35:30 GMT
I never thought I would see World Conqueror 4 outside of WC4 forums. Azur Lane. That is a real moment. |
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Post by Nobunaga Oda on Feb 28, 2024 18:25:52 GMT
Are they there to make fun of war or are they there to make war fun? That's the question.
Thanks to a certain superhero action movie, perhaps the Terrorists succeeded because of the relics of a lost kingdom.
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Post by verily on Feb 28, 2024 23:40:07 GMT
I never thought I would see World Conqueror 4 outside of WC4 forums. real, im suprised too see it. |
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On a more positive note, it's actually surprising how much we seem to agree lol.
