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Post by jonblend on Mar 20, 2022 10:09:46 GMT
I'm still unsure about the "countered enemies". So I tested to see if there is a difference in damage from attacking vs counterattacking. Both were done with restarts in between and I didn't attack for the counterattacking part.
The setup was the first mission of hero legend 12 and I gathered at least 10 damage values from critical hits (we've come far for them to be more likely than normal hits) so I could calculate the average damage over these crits and compare them. I made sure not to loose too much HP to trigger a lower formation coefficient. Eagle Cohort [EC] was at lv3 (18%) for the second run. Holy Damage was off and Riding Master lv3 was tested as well so we can expect a 3*3% difference. The general was Commander with Cav com, Assault, Guerilla and March which means no benefits for "when attacking" except for +10% crit rate from the banner.
attacking mammoth: 313.1 counterattacking mammoth: 276.2
attacking mammoth with EC: 336.3 counterattacking mammoth with EC: 272.7
attacking light cavalry: 462 counterattacking light cav: 410.4
attacking light cav with EC: 537 counterattacking light cav with EC: 484.3
Now, if EC would work like the "counterattack" skill then we should see higher damage during counterattacks because +18% from EC should be more than +9% from Riding Master. However, the opposite is true, which leaves us to wonder about "countered enemies".
Looking at the light cavalry results, we can observe a +16%/+18% for both attacking and counterattacking with EC (on top of/independently from the Riding Master bonus). For mammoth, the difference is only +7.4%/-1.5% and thus more in the range of statistical fluctuations than 18%. This is suspicious...
Maybe the red/blue sword symbol which is explained to us in the last tutorial mission indicates countered enemies??
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Post by Navia Lanoira on Mar 20, 2022 11:51:44 GMT
I'm still unsure about the "countered enemies". So I tested to see if there is a difference in damage from attacking vs counterattacking. Both were done with restarts in between and I didn't attack for the counterattacking part.
The setup was the first mission of hero legend 12 and I gathered at least 10 damage values from critical hits (we've come far for them to be more likely than normal hits) so I could calculate the average damage over these crits and compare them. I made sure not to loose too much HP to trigger a lower formation coefficient. Eagle Cohort [EC] was at lv3 (18%) for the second run. Holy Damage was off and Riding Master lv3 was tested as well so we can expect a 3*3% difference. The general was Commander with Cav com, Assault, Guerilla and March which means no benefits for "when attacking" except for +10% crit rate from the banner.
attacking mammoth: 313.1 counterattacking mammoth: 276.2
attacking mammoth with EC: 336.3 counterattacking mammoth with EC: 272.7
attacking light cavalry: 462 counterattacking light cav: 410.4
attacking light cav with EC: 537 counterattacking light cav with EC: 484.3
Now, if EC would work like the "counterattack" skill then we should see higher damage during counterattacks because +18% from EC should be more than +9% from Riding Master. However, the opposite is true, which leaves us to wonder about "countered enemies".
Looking at the light cavalry results, we can observe a +16%/+18% for both attacking and counterattacking with EC (on top of/independently from the Riding Master bonus). For mammoth, the difference is only +7.4%/+1.5% and thus more in the range of statistical fluctuations than 18%. This is suspicious...
Maybe the red/blue sword symbol which is explained to us in the last tutorial mission indicates countered enemies??
I believe yes. Or most probably what it counters the most. Like thump delivers >100% against heavy armored And why would a volcano be an enemy fortification? Most of all wow nice temple there |
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Post by jonblend on Mar 22, 2022 14:48:00 GMT
Maybe the red/blue sword symbol which is explained to us in the last tutorial mission indicates countered enemies??
I believe yes. Or most probably what it counters the most. Like thump delivers >100% against heavy armored And why would a volcano be an enemy fortification? Most of all wow nice temple there If the theory is true then unarmored (125% from slashing [in this case]) should also get more damage with EC. More testing or asking Erich von Manstein about the effect could help here (but I don't have the time to properly do the former  And, don't you think that all volcanoes are evil and should be destroyed  |
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Post by Sun Ce on Apr 23, 2022 21:27:56 GMT
I believe yes. Or most probably what it counters the most. Like thump delivers >100% against heavy armored And why would a volcano be an enemy fortification? Most of all wow nice temple there If the theory is true then unarmored (125% from slashing [in this case]) should also get more damage with EC. More testing or asking Erich von Manstein about the effect could help here (but I don't have the time to properly do the former And, don't you think that all volcanoes are evil and should be destroyed They have changed the description to "deal more damage when attack type counters enemy armor type" Still don't know if it is anything higher than 100% or every weapon counters one armor though |
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Post by andrei on Apr 23, 2022 21:32:11 GMT
If the theory is true then unarmored (125% from slashing [in this case]) should also get more damage with EC. More testing or asking Erich von Manstein about the effect could help here (but I don't have the time to properly do the former  And, don't you think that all volcanoes are evil and should be destroyed  They have changed the description to "deal more damage when attack type counters enemy armor type" Still don't know if it is anything higher than 100% or every weapon counters one armor though I think it just adds the effectiveness of the weapon. Like in case Slashing deals 80% to heavy armor badge will add the corresponding % |
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Post by Erich von Manstein on Apr 24, 2022 0:38:57 GMT
They have changed the description to "deal more damage when attack type counters enemy armor type" Still don't know if it is anything higher than 100% or every weapon counters one armor though I think it just adds the effectiveness of the weapon. Like in case Slashing deals 80% to heavy armor badge will add the corresponding % I think it only applies when it is greater than 100%. |
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Post by andrei on Apr 24, 2022 4:45:50 GMT
I think it just adds the effectiveness of the weapon. Like in case Slashing deals 80% to heavy armor badge will add the corresponding % I think it only applies when it is greater than 100%. Imo it would be way too complicated to use/program different formula for such a simple mechanic as badge buff. The game would need to recognise every single time during the attack whether this armor type is higher or lower than 100% effective against this or that weapon. Very unlikely. |
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Post by jonblend on Apr 24, 2022 13:07:32 GMT
I think it just adds the effectiveness of the weapon. Like in case Slashing deals 80% to heavy armor badge will add the corresponding % I think it only applies when it is greater than 100%. , my testing confirms this because in the example there is additional damage against the light cav (equal to the EC value) but damage against mammoth remains the same. Also, from a programming point of view it's not that difficult to implement. |
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Post by Theron of Acragas on Apr 26, 2022 6:25:55 GMT
I think it only applies when it is greater than 100%. Imo it would be way too complicated to use/program different formula for such a simple mechanic as badge buff. The game would need to recognise every single time during the attack whether this armor type is higher or lower than 100% effective against this or that weapon. Very unlikely. As a programmer, the formula is super simple, because in any case it needs to know about the armor effect and the badge buff. The extra check if the armor coefficient is greater than 100 is nothing. |
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Post by zink on Apr 30, 2022 17:27:51 GMT
I'm still unsure about the "countered enemies". So I tested to see if there is a difference in damage from attacking vs counterattacking. Both were done with restarts in between and I didn't attack for the counterattacking part.
The setup was the first mission of hero legend 12 and I gathered at least 10 damage values from critical hits (we've come far for them to be more likely than normal hits) so I could calculate the average damage over these crits and compare them. I made sure not to loose too much HP to trigger a lower formation coefficient. Eagle Cohort [EC] was at lv3 (18%) for the second run. Holy Damage was off and Riding Master lv3 was tested as well so we can expect a 3*3% difference. The general was Commander with Cav com, Assault, Guerilla and March which means no benefits for "when attacking" except for +10% crit rate from the banner.
attacking mammoth: 313.1 counterattacking mammoth: 276.2
attacking mammoth with EC: 336.3 counterattacking mammoth with EC: 272.7
attacking light cavalry: 462 counterattacking light cav: 410.4
attacking light cav with EC: 537 counterattacking light cav with EC: 484.3
Now, if EC would work like the "counterattack" skill then we should see higher damage during counterattacks because +18% from EC should be more than +9% from Riding Master. However, the opposite is true, which leaves us to wonder about "countered enemies".
Looking at the light cavalry results, we can observe a +16%/+18% for both attacking and counterattacking with EC (on top of/independently from the Riding Master bonus). For mammoth, the difference is only +7.4%/-1.5% and thus more in the range of statistical fluctuations than 18%. This is suspicious...
Maybe the red/blue sword symbol which is explained to us in the last tutorial mission indicates countered enemies??
I feel like a moron for ignoring that lil sword symbol for so long Literally just yesterday I figured out what it meant Seems good for Hannibal in arena mode due to elephant having thump |
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