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Post by John Marston on Sept 22, 2021 16:47:19 GMT
Not so fast. It can also be debated that Roko wins because of his large damage to armor. And the damage in which Monty is better is rarely used or can be dealt with easily (arty and inf respectively). Um, Infantry is definitely the main enemy of an HT, and Monty does this the best out of anyone. Tanks are essentially what you hit if they are almost dead so you can get a reset. Same with Artillery. Monty is a lot better than Roko at clearing out large areas. 5 damage is negligible. You need to do more damage to the Armored units as they have the most health. And why is infantry the main enemy of HT? |
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Post by idunnowhattocallthis on Sept 22, 2021 17:02:06 GMT
Um, Infantry is definitely the main enemy of an HT, and Monty does this the best out of anyone. Tanks are essentially what you hit if they are almost dead so you can get a reset. Same with Artillery. Monty is a lot better than Roko at clearing out large areas. 5 damage is negligible. You need to do more damage to the Armored units as they have the most health. And why is infantry the main enemy of HT? Infantry is considered the main enemy of HT because it (HT) has a buff against infantry |
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Post by Gerd von Rundstedt on Sept 22, 2021 17:31:56 GMT
Um, Infantry is definitely the main enemy of an HT, and Monty does this the best out of anyone. Tanks are essentially what you hit if they are almost dead so you can get a reset. Same with Artillery. Monty is a lot better than Roko at clearing out large areas. 5 damage is negligible. You need to do more damage to the Armored units as they have the most health. And why is infantry the main enemy of HT? Monty's 5 damage is.multiplied by the 30% actually, so it is around 6, as the data shows. And if that is negligible, Roko does only around 9-11 extra damage to tanks, which is only ×1.5 to ×2 that negligible amount. Sad! Not good! |
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Post by John Marston on Sept 22, 2021 17:36:31 GMT
5 damage is negligible. You need to do more damage to the Armored units as they have the most health. And why is infantry the main enemy of HT? Monty's 5 damage is.multiplied by the 30% actually, so it is around 6, as the data shows. And if that is negligible, Roko does only around 9-11 extra damage to tanks, which is only ×1.5 to ×2 that negligible amount. Sad! Not good! What about the 105 extra medals? |
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Post by Gerd von Rundstedt on Sept 22, 2021 17:38:21 GMT
Monty's 5 damage is.multiplied by the 30% actually, so it is around 6, as the data shows. And if that is negligible, Roko does only around 9-11 extra damage to tanks, which is only ×1.5 to ×2 that negligible amount. Sad! Not good! What about the 105 extra medals? Well, that goes to the extra level of Machinist, AF, 3 air, and presence in two useful lineups compared to zero. Also, the sheer awesomeness of his beret. |
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Post by Lucklife on Sept 22, 2021 23:35:54 GMT
I think you all should also look at damage percentages.
At Tech 4, the enemy in battle of salient,
tanks have 184 health per stack, infantry has 100 health per stack.
It's easier to trigger the 60% chance to attack again by attacking an infantry - especially a damaged one. As long as the infantry only has about 60% of its health left, your HT has a strong chance to attack again.
On the other hand, we're dealing about 30% of a tank's full hp. Which means that your other troops will have to pound it all the way down before the HT can comes in to try and get that 60% chance to attack again.
I'll like to think as panzer leader being a backup 24%, with the most important being the 60% that tanks have.
As such, I do agree that infantry is the main enemy of HT, not just from the buffs, but also due to the relative ease of triggering the 60% chance to attack again, turning the HT into an infantry mower.
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Post by 6Johnny23 on Sept 23, 2021 12:28:24 GMT
Not so fast. It can also be debated that Roko wins because of his large damage to armor. And the damage in which Monty is better is rarely used or can be dealt with easily (arty and inf respectively). Monty is gorgeous. And the statistics show it. The main target for HT is infantry. This is the most common Unit throughout the game. And Monty takes it off like nuts reloading his Panzer Leader. About Anti-Armor. Both Monty and Roco hit the tank 1-2 times when he has low health to annihilate him and reload PL. No one on HT will attack other full HP tank. It's just waste a resources. As a result, Rocko is overrated as his Anti-Armor. So the total damage for Monty's campaign will be higher. Monty is overrated as is his Machinist and 3* in air if Roko is overrated as is Anti-Armor. You already do good damage to inf with Roko and literally anything short of arty can deal with inf, other inf, tanks, fighters. You do know that PL only has a 24% chance so you can't spam 2 attacks? Also, you can always attack with the 2 range ET has provided for you and then again, HTs are uncommon if not negligible unless spawning a general. Machinist gets worse as your general get better. It's a skill one would find good when they are in a defense mission and are out of money. But when you upgrade your stars and get your HP to ridiculous amounts, Machinist becomes really bad. 3* on air is a niche that really isn't very good. You either have to land on an airport and not transfer that airport in the far more competent hands of Halsey or Dowding, or Arnold, as they will do a better job of sitting there are firing off attacks on the enemy. I don't want to waste my HT for air attacks. |
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Post by stoic on Sept 23, 2021 13:14:30 GMT
I tend to agree with 6Johnny23. Our heavy tanks don't attack in a vacuum, neither do they attack first. Usually we use the rest of our units to create as many weak spots and holes as possible and only then we unleash a whirlwind of death of heavy tanks. It is a waste to attack a unit (even an infantry unit) with full health with your heavy tank if you have other means to weaken it beforehand. And, don't forget that 60 percent probability to attack again means that there's 40 percent probability not to attack again after annihilating a harmless infantry unit. |
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Post by metalleater on Sept 23, 2021 22:47:45 GMT
Monty is gorgeous. And the statistics show it. The main target for HT is infantry. This is the most common Unit throughout the game. And Monty takes it off like nuts reloading his Panzer Leader. About Anti-Armor. Both Monty and Roco hit the tank 1-2 times when he has low health to annihilate him and reload PL. No one on HT will attack other full HP tank. It's just waste a resources. As a result, Rocko is overrated as his Anti-Armor. So the total damage for Monty's campaign will be higher. Monty is overrated as is his Machinist and 3* in air if Roko is overrated as is Anti-Armor. You already do good damage to inf with Roko and literally anything short of arty can deal with inf, other inf, tanks, fighters. You do know that PL only has a 24% chance so you can't spam 2 attacks? Also, you can always attack with the 2 range ET has provided for you and then again, HTs are uncommon if not negligible unless spawning a general. Machinist gets worse as your general get better. It's a skill one would find good when they are in a defense mission and are out of money. But when you upgrade your stars and get your HP to ridiculous amounts, Machinist becomes really bad. 3* on air is a niche that really isn't very good. You either have to land on an airport and not transfer that airport in the far more competent hands of Halsey or Dowding, or Arnold, as they will do a better job of sitting there are firing off attacks on the enemy. I don't want to waste my HT for air attacks. You say you don't want to waste your HT. Because you understand, any unit is resource to reach the victory. And as you know, in any game mode, these resources are limited. Generals are limited, gold is limited, even time is limited, etc So it is Monty who gives these resources. What is important, Monty is versatile and allows you to use these resources with maximum efficiency. 1. Monty is better at killing infantry, artillery and even ships. 2. He can go to the factory and heal more health thanks to Replenish. This is very important, damage depends on health. Any general will have to heal and buy their units in factory or city. Monty gets the advantage. Replanish is perfect for HT! 3. Monty on HT can go to the airfield and do his job, for example punish the enemy artillery. Thanks to 3 Air stars, +15 damage from each air strike. It's really cool! You don't have to keep HT at the airfield all the time. You should go to the airfield when you have gold for air strikes. One turn in the airfield is enough to clear the entire battlefield. 4. Monty participates in 3 campaigns. And Roco is only in one. Thanks to this, Monty will bring many more medals. 5. Again about resources. Monty retains a slot for an additional general for 3 campaigns. This is why I am using Monty. And he is truly unique and versatile. |
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Post by 6Johnny23 on Sept 24, 2021 12:36:11 GMT
Monty is overrated as is his Machinist and 3* in air if Roko is overrated as is Anti-Armor. You already do good damage to inf with Roko and literally anything short of arty can deal with inf, other inf, tanks, fighters. You do know that PL only has a 24% chance so you can't spam 2 attacks? Also, you can always attack with the 2 range ET has provided for you and then again, HTs are uncommon if not negligible unless spawning a general. Machinist gets worse as your general get better. It's a skill one would find good when they are in a defense mission and are out of money. But when you upgrade your stars and get your HP to ridiculous amounts, Machinist becomes really bad. 3* on air is a niche that really isn't very good. You either have to land on an airport and not transfer that airport in the far more competent hands of Halsey or Dowding, or Arnold, as they will do a better job of sitting there are firing off attacks on the enemy. I don't want to waste my HT for air attacks. You say you don't want to waste your HT. Because you understand, any unit is resource to reach the victory. And as you know, in any game mode, these resources are limited. Generals are limited, gold is limited, even time is limited, etc So it is Monty who gives these resources. What is important, Monty is versatile and allows you to use these resources with maximum efficiency. 1. Monty is better at killing infantry, artillery and even ships. 2. He can go to the factory and heal more health thanks to Replenish. This is very important, damage depends on health. Any general will have to heal and buy their units in factory or city. Monty gets the advantage. Replanish is perfect for HT! 3. Monty on HT can go to the airfield and do his job, for example punish the enemy artillery. Thanks to 3 Air stars, +15 damage from each air strike. It's really cool! You don't have to keep HT at the airfield all the time. You should go to the airfield when you have gold for air strikes. One turn in the airfield is enough to clear the entire battlefield. 4. Monty participates in 3 campaigns. And Roco is only in one. Thanks to this, Monty will bring many more medals. 5. Again about resources. Monty retains a slot for an additional general for 3 campaigns. This is why I am using Monty. And he is truly unique and versatile. 1. Infantry is harmless and weak without a general, artillery is scarce, and ships are dealt with by other ships (or arty, you don't want to waste your time) 2. If you get better generals (*s), Replenish will be close to useless and Recruiting tends to be better than Replenishing, which tends to be a last-ditch effort. The only viable time for replenishingis on the campaign but you have other generals (ahem, MacArthur) that need that gold more than Monty, who is literally on a tank. 3. Just because you have *s on a type doesn't mean you are good at it. Take our good friend Rommel. Say hi, Rommel! He has 3*s in arty. He doesn't get put on arty often as you have other generals and he has no skills for arty (besides DF, but DF is very situational). Tanks are used to push, they are probably the unit that pushes and deals the most damage. Moving back to "clear the battlefield" with Monty will take hundreds of coins, unless someone else has cleared the battlefield. 4. 20 medals is not a lot. Certainly not enough to warrant a whole argument. One of them is 1939, and I did that with only Leclerc and Cunningham, so you can do it too. With MacArthur (or I was very lucky with Roko), Vulcan was a breeze and straight to my next Pacific 1942, Europe 1944. The only one where Monty would be useful for me, besides that 1 campaign in Africa (for me), but Vatutin could help too, not a big statement. If you medal grind, you do it with Guderian and friends, not with Monty and the medal earning process is very slow, you will need a lot more than 1 medal a campaign to make a difference. 5. The slots match the player very well in bought generals, you will mostly use free generals as benchfillers and when Monty matters most (1944), you have a whopping 3 slots (1 for MacArthur). One for Patton, one for Roko, and one for Govorov/Chuikov, swap as needed. I don't have Patton so I us Leclerc no biggie. On 1941 Africa, you will need more generals, in general, not just another Roko. |
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Post by 6Johnny23 on Sept 24, 2021 12:41:21 GMT
You say you don't want to waste your HT. Because you understand, any unit is resource to reach the victory. And as you know, in any game mode, these resources are limited. Generals are limited, gold is limited, even time is limited, etc So it is Monty who gives these resources. What is important, Monty is versatile and allows you to use these resources with maximum efficiency. 1. Monty is better at killing infantry, artillery and even ships. 2. He can go to the factory and heal more health thanks to Replenish. This is very important, damage depends on health. Any general will have to heal and buy their units in factory or city. Monty gets the advantage. Replanish is perfect for HT! 3. Monty on HT can go to the airfield and do his job, for example punish the enemy artillery. Thanks to 3 Air stars, +15 damage from each air strike. It's really cool! You don't have to keep HT at the airfield all the time. You should go to the airfield when you have gold for air strikes. One turn in the airfield is enough to clear the entire battlefield. 4. Monty participates in 3 campaigns. And Roco is only in one. Thanks to this, Monty will bring many more medals. 5. Again about resources. Monty retains a slot for an additional general for 3 campaigns. This is why I am using Monty. And he is truly unique and versatile. 1. Infantry is harmless and weak without a general, artillery is scarce, and ships are dealt with by other ships (or arty, you don't want to waste your time) 2. If you get better generals (*s), Replenish will be close to useless and Recruiting tends to be better than Replenishing, which tends to be a last-ditch effort. The only viable time for replenishingis on the campaign but you have other generals (ahem, MacArthur) that need that gold more than Monty, who is literally on a tank. 3. Just because you have *s on a type doesn't mean you are good at it. Take our good friend Rommel. Say hi, Rommel! He has 3*s in arty. He doesn't get put on arty often as you have other generals and he has no skills for arty (besides DF, but DF is very situational). Tanks are used to push, they are probably the unit that pushes and deals the most damage. Moving back to "clear the battlefield" with Monty will take hundreds of coins, unless someone else has cleared the battlefield. 4. 20 medals is not a lot. Certainly not enough to warrant a whole argument. One of them is 1939, and I did that with only Leclerc and Cunningham, so you can do it too. With MacArthur (or I was very lucky with Roko), Vulcan was a breeze and straight to my next Pacific 1942, Europe 1944. The only one where Monty would be useful for me, besides that 1 campaign in Africa (for me), but Vatutin could help too, not a big statement. If you medal grind, you do it with Guderian and friends, not with Monty and the medal earning process is very slow, you will need a lot more than 1 medal a campaign to make a difference. 5. The slots match the player very well in bought generals, you will mostly use free generals as benchfillers and when Monty matters most (1944), you have a whopping 3 slots (1 for MacArthur). One for Patton, one for Roko, and one for Govorov/Chuikov, swap as needed. I don't have Patton so I us Leclerc no biggie. On 1941 Africa, you will need more generals, in general, not just another Roko. About the economics thing at your tip-top, wasting coins on sup-par attacks when Dowding and Halsey are right there and one is very cheap, that not using to resources efficiently. You say Monty gets the resources the best, but all generals can do it. Yamashita with a Wiking can do it mighty fine. Roko with a KV-6 steamrolls enemies. Everything may be limited, but Monty does not use these resources to your best ability or interests. If you replenish, replenish, replenish, you will need the extra damage from a stack. Using your generals smart isn't "oh, a hybrid general saves $ and slots", no. Use them to the best of their ability and they will shine. |
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Post by Gerd von Rundstedt on Sept 24, 2021 12:51:05 GMT
You say you don't want to waste your HT. Because you understand, any unit is resource to reach the victory. And as you know, in any game mode, these resources are limited. Generals are limited, gold is limited, even time is limited, etc So it is Monty who gives these resources. What is important, Monty is versatile and allows you to use these resources with maximum efficiency. 1. Monty is better at killing infantry, artillery and even ships. 2. He can go to the factory and heal more health thanks to Replenish. This is very important, damage depends on health. Any general will have to heal and buy their units in factory or city. Monty gets the advantage. Replanish is perfect for HT! 3. Monty on HT can go to the airfield and do his job, for example punish the enemy artillery. Thanks to 3 Air stars, +15 damage from each air strike. It's really cool! You don't have to keep HT at the airfield all the time. You should go to the airfield when you have gold for air strikes. One turn in the airfield is enough to clear the entire battlefield. 4. Monty participates in 3 campaigns. And Roco is only in one. Thanks to this, Monty will bring many more medals. 5. Again about resources. Monty retains a slot for an additional general for 3 campaigns. This is why I am using Monty. And he is truly unique and versatile. 1. Infantry is harmless and weak without a general, artillery is scarce, and ships are dealt with by other ships (or arty, you don't want to waste your time) 2. If you get better generals (*s), Replenish will be close to useless and Recruiting tends to be better than Replenishing, which tends to be a last-ditch effort. The only viable time for replenishingis on the campaign but you have other generals (ahem, MacArthur) that need that gold more than Monty, who is literally on a tank. 3. Just because you have *s on a type doesn't mean you are good at it. Take our good friend Rommel. Say hi, Rommel! He has 3*s in arty. He doesn't get put on arty often as you have other generals and he has no skills for arty (besides DF, but DF is very situational). Tanks are used to push, they are probably the unit that pushes and deals the most damage. Moving back to "clear the battlefield" with Monty will take hundreds of coins, unless someone else has cleared the battlefield. 4. 20 medals is not a lot. Certainly not enough to warrant a whole argument. One of them is 1939, and I did that with only Leclerc and Cunningham, so you can do it too. With MacArthur (or I was very lucky with Roko), Vulcan was a breeze and straight to my next Pacific 1942, Europe 1944. The only one where Monty would be useful for me, besides that 1 campaign in Africa (for me), but Vatutin could help too, not a big statement. If you medal grind, you do it with Guderian and friends, not with Monty and the medal earning process is very slow, you will need a lot more than 1 medal a campaign to make a difference. 5. The slots match the player very well in bought generals, you will mostly use free generals as benchfillers and when Monty matters most (1944), you have a whopping 3 slots (1 for MacArthur). One for Patton, one for Roko, and one for Govorov/Chuikov, swap as needed. I don't have Patton so I us Leclerc no biggie. On 1941 Africa, you will need more generals, in general, not just another Roko. 1. No, it is not, even weak infantry is still a pest at taking cities (flashback to Malayan campaign), and needs to be killed as much as any other unit. Heavy Artillery is the number one target when it shows up, and ships... you are right about that. 2. Even with 4 stars, a replenish with gold Machinist still gives more than Half HP. 3. It is likely that one gets Monty before they do an air gen. If so, then Arnold isn't much better than Monty at clearing the battlefield. What I think Monty's job is is to put a significant dent into each of the enemy's infantry in order to trigger quite a few resets. 4. I didn't get Monty until after Iwo Jima, so I can't say much, but in the course of me perfecting N. Africa and Western Europe, he made me 83 medals. Granted, that may be because I am very bad at this game and had to redo missions over and over (Operation Compass, I missed that secondary objective city by one turn for 6 tries). But still!  5. Generally, by the time they get to 1944, the player will have MacArthur, Govorov, and Tanker Gen. Monty frees up a space there for Timoshenko or Chuikov. |
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Post by John Marston on Sept 24, 2021 15:31:18 GMT
1. Infantry is harmless and weak without a general, artillery is scarce, and ships are dealt with by other ships (or arty, you don't want to waste your time) 2. If you get better generals (*s), Replenish will be close to useless and Recruiting tends to be better than Replenishing, which tends to be a last-ditch effort. The only viable time for replenishingis on the campaign but you have other generals (ahem, MacArthur) that need that gold more than Monty, who is literally on a tank. 3. Just because you have *s on a type doesn't mean you are good at it. Take our good friend Rommel. Say hi, Rommel! He has 3*s in arty. He doesn't get put on arty often as you have other generals and he has no skills for arty (besides DF, but DF is very situational). Tanks are used to push, they are probably the unit that pushes and deals the most damage. Moving back to "clear the battlefield" with Monty will take hundreds of coins, unless someone else has cleared the battlefield. 4. 20 medals is not a lot. Certainly not enough to warrant a whole argument. One of them is 1939, and I did that with only Leclerc and Cunningham, so you can do it too. With MacArthur (or I was very lucky with Roko), Vulcan was a breeze and straight to my next Pacific 1942, Europe 1944. The only one where Monty would be useful for me, besides that 1 campaign in Africa (for me), but Vatutin could help too, not a big statement. If you medal grind, you do it with Guderian and friends, not with Monty and the medal earning process is very slow, you will need a lot more than 1 medal a campaign to make a difference. 5. The slots match the player very well in bought generals, you will mostly use free generals as benchfillers and when Monty matters most (1944), you have a whopping 3 slots (1 for MacArthur). One for Patton, one for Roko, and one for Govorov/Chuikov, swap as needed. I don't have Patton so I us Leclerc no biggie. On 1941 Africa, you will need more generals, in general, not just another Roko. 1. No, it is not, even weak infantry is still a pest at taking cities (flashback to Malayan campaign), and needs to be killed as much as any other unit. Heavy Artillery is the number one target when it shows up, and ships... you are right about that. 2. Even with 4 stars, a replenish with gold Machinist still gives more than Half HP. 3. It is likely that one gets Monty before they do an air gen. If so, then Arnold isn't much better than Monty at clearing the battlefield. What I think Monty's job is is to put a significant dent into each of the enemy's infantry in order to trigger quite a few resets. 4. I didn't get Monty until after Iwo Jima, so I can't say much, but in the course of me perfecting N. Africa and Western Europe, he made me 83 medals. Granted, that may be because I am very bad at this game and had to redo missions over and over (Operation Compass, I missed that secondary objective city by one turn for 6 tries). But still! 5. Generally, by the time they get to 1944, the player will have MacArthur, Govorov, and Tanker Gen. Monty frees up a space there for Timoshenko or Chuikov. 1. So you don't send your tank general in the middle of an important fight to kill a pesky weak infantry right? 2. Recruiting is more optimal. 3. According to that logic, Monty's air stars are nullified as he can make a "Bigger Dent" on tanks. 4. I think that since you usually have more Axis generals, grinding them is much better. 5. True, but 1944 is doable with the given slots (Assuming you don't get any general who is in 44 campaign). |
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Post by Gerd von Rundstedt on Sept 24, 2021 16:25:00 GMT
1. No, it is not, even weak infantry is still a pest at taking cities (flashback to Malayan campaign), and needs to be killed as much as any other unit. Heavy Artillery is the number one target when it shows up, and ships... you are right about that. 2. Even with 4 stars, a replenish with gold Machinist still gives more than Half HP. 3. It is likely that one gets Monty before they do an air gen. If so, then Arnold isn't much better than Monty at clearing the battlefield. What I think Monty's job is is to put a significant dent into each of the enemy's infantry in order to trigger quite a few resets. 4. I didn't get Monty until after Iwo Jima, so I can't say much, but in the course of me perfecting N. Africa and Western Europe, he made me 83 medals. Granted, that may be because I am very bad at this game and had to redo missions over and over (Operation Compass, I missed that secondary objective city by one turn for 6 tries). But still! 5. Generally, by the time they get to 1944, the player will have MacArthur, Govorov, and Tanker Gen. Monty frees up a space there for Timoshenko or Chuikov. 1. So you don't send your tank general in the middle of an important fight to kill a pesky weak infantry right? 2. Recruiting is more optimal. 3. According to that logic, Monty's air stars are nullified as he can make a "Bigger Dent" on tanks. 4. I think that since you usually have more Axis generals, grinding them is much better. 5. True, but 1944 is doable with the given slots (Assuming you don't get any general who is in 44 campaign). 1. Yes, I primarily use my KV-6 to kill infantry. 2. Um, if Recruiting does more than half HP for Half the price, that would make Replenishing more optimal. 3. I don't understand, but I use him to launch 1 fighter strike per infantry so that he can get resets easily on them. 4. That's fair, but I wasn't grinding with him at all, just replaying missions for perfect clears. 5. That is true, but an extra general definitely makes missions like Marching to Italy and Normandy easier. |
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Post by John Marston on Sept 24, 2021 16:30:28 GMT
1. So you don't send your tank general in the middle of an important fight to kill a pesky weak infantry right? 2. Recruiting is more optimal. 3. According to that logic, Monty's air stars are nullified as he can make a "Bigger Dent" on tanks. 4. I think that since you usually have more Axis generals, grinding them is much better. 5. True, but 1944 is doable with the given slots (Assuming you don't get any general who is in 44 campaign). 1. Yes, I primarily use my KV-6 to kill infantry. 2. Um, if Recruiting does more than half HP for Half the price, that would make Replenishing more optimal. 3. I don't understand, but I use him to launch 1 fighter strike per infantry so that he can get resets easily on them. 4. That's fair, but I wasn't grinding with him at all, just replaying missions for perfect clears. 5. That is true, but an extra general definitely makes missions like Marching to Italy and Normandy easier. 1. Just kill them via Air/Air reinforcements/other reinforcements. My point is, you don't want to take your tank general away from the battleground. 2. I give that. But replenishing also isn't optimal either as they basically are the same. 3. I meant that Monty can make a much bigger impact while fighting on tanks as compared to fighting on air. 5. Alright, I give that. |
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