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Post by charlesmartell on Dec 19, 2023 4:14:45 GMT
I was lucky and got my fourth gold general (along with Kinoshita, Tokugawa and Mori) Akechi Mitsuhide. He's specialization is musket, but he looks pretty weak. He has only 4 musket icons and only 3rd level of shooting. Also his active dealt only 70% of dmg and gives morale. And his stats on level one is below average (Leadership 92, Valor 80, Agility 73 and Intellect 93). His unit is Rain-covering Teppo, who needs to be purchased. So my only question is - whats the point of using Akechi when I have Suzuki with better stats, 5 musket icons, 4th level shooting ability and greater active (100% dmg and free move)? Should I especially for Akechi purchase Rain Teppo? I really don't understand why this general is gold and how he can be more effective than Suzuki?
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𝕵𝖔𝖆𝖓 𝖔𝖋 𝕬𝖗𝖈
Major
(Currently Sieging Orléans)
Posts: 164
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Post by 𝕵𝖔𝖆𝖓 𝖔𝖋 𝕬𝖗𝖈 on Dec 19, 2023 6:30:44 GMT
I personally have completely abandoned him. He's good for novelty but he sucks. He killed Nobunaga, was shogun for only three days, and he's not all that great of a general. Keep Suzuki. Rain teppo is gonna be useful for other musket generals you may have an eye on.
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Post by Theron of Acragas on Dec 19, 2023 7:26:12 GMT
I feel like all the F2P gold generals are kind of disappointing. All of them have purple equivalents that are as good or better. Only Hojo really has a claim to be best at his position, and even he isn't clearly better than Sorin (though there's room for both in your lineup).
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Post by balthazar on Dec 19, 2023 8:06:09 GMT
I dont count akechi or tokugawa as f2p generals without library chapters. In this getting generals is not the catch but the upgrading them is. There is almost no viable way of upgrading them through sheer luck in drops or daily missions where you could improve other generals as well. Right now campaign can be played with 1-star generals and we dont notice. But they will be useless in future content where we will need 3+stars. So I dont invest in them at all even though tokugawa is a very strong starter unlike akechi.
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Post by hubub on Dec 19, 2023 9:49:10 GMT
I have him, and honestly, he isn’t that disappointing to me, he just requires equipment that builds up him crit rate, I use the Inoshishi set, the Armour with peach type helmet and a leveled up Muramasa (you could still use the equipment on Suzuki). Even without the equipment, he is still the 3nd best F2P musket general and can match Suzuki. He would be better if you improved his stats and I think it would be useful to have 2 musket generals for harder campaigns, tenkabito and conquests in general. Still train him until you get Kazumasa, who is better (when he is at 4 stars). As for his damage, its fine, it is very similar to Suzuki.
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Post by Theron of Acragas on Dec 19, 2023 13:34:42 GMT
I dont count akechi or tokugawa as f2p generals without library chapters. In this getting generals is not the catch but the upgrading them is. There is almost no viable way of upgrading them through sheer luck in drops or daily missions where you could improve other generals as well. Right now campaign can be played with 1-star generals and we dont notice. But they will be useless in future content where we will need 3+stars. So I dont invest in them at all even though tokugawa is a very strong starter unlike akechi. You can get six fragments a day from Bugyosho missions with maxed Tenshu. If you give them all to one general, that will take you from level 1 to level 3 in 15 days, or level 4 in another 15. It's definitely a bit grindy, but bearable for a limited number of generals. It's simply not worth it for Akechi and Tokugawa just because they aren't that good. There are at least two purple teppos better than Akechi, and while Tokugawa could be a starter Chosokabe is better (and has a library chapter), and other purples like Takenaka and Saito Dosan are also passable. |
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Post by stoic on Dec 19, 2023 14:23:18 GMT
I dont count akechi or tokugawa as f2p generals without library chapters. In this getting generals is not the catch but the upgrading them is. There is almost no viable way of upgrading them through sheer luck in drops or daily missions where you could improve other generals as well. Right now campaign can be played with 1-star generals and we dont notice. But they will be useless in future content where we will need 3+stars. So I dont invest in them at all even though tokugawa is a very strong starter unlike akechi. You can get six fragments a day from Bugyosho missions with maxed Tenshu. If you give them all to one general, that will take you from level 1 to level 3 in 15 days, or level 4 in another 15. It's definitely a bit grindy, but bearable for a limited number of generals. It's simply not worth it for Akechi and Tokugawa just because they aren't that good. There are at least two purple teppos better than Akechi, and while Tokugawa could be a starter Chosokabe is better (and has a library chapter), and other purples like Takenaka and Saito Dosan are also passable. Indeed we have a peculiar situation here when a top tier general is potentially a worse option than 5 other Teppo generals (Nobunaga, Suzuki, Tachibana, Date and Tokigava). |
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Post by stoic on Dec 19, 2023 15:22:00 GMT
I am not even sure that Akechi will outperform Kuroda eventually  , who is an Infantry general but has two excellent skills for a teppo general... |
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Post by Theron of Acragas on Dec 19, 2023 17:00:13 GMT
I am not even sure that Akechi will outperform Kuroda eventually , who is an Infantry general but has two excellent skills for a teppo general... Yeah, his level 6 skill does fit better with teppo or archer. Akechi does have two extra levels of adaptability though - do we have any definite information on what exactly adaptability does (I assume attack bonus) and how significant that difference is? |
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Post by stoic on Dec 19, 2023 17:35:19 GMT
I am not even sure that Akechi will outperform Kuroda eventually , who is an Infantry general but has two excellent skills for a teppo general... Yeah, his level 6 skill does fit better with teppo or archer. Akechi does have two extra levels of adaptability though - do we have any definite information on what exactly adaptability does (I assume attack bonus) and how significant that difference is? Akechi has only 4 Musket Adaptability, so even in this department he's underperforming as a Teppo general. We can only guess what the difference between Adaptability 3 and 4 really is. But usually it is 5-6 points of attack. |
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Post by Theron of Acragas on Dec 19, 2023 17:37:33 GMT
Yeah, his level 6 skill does fit better with teppo or archer. Akechi does have two extra levels of adaptability though - do we have any definite information on what exactly adaptability does (I assume attack bonus) and how significant that difference is? Akechi has only 4 Musket Adaptability, so even in this department he's underperforming as a Teppo general. We can only guess what the difference between Adaptability 3 and 4 really is. But usually it is 5-6 points of attack. Any idea how much damage that translates to on average? GCS seems to be much worse than other ET games at telling us what stats actually mean. |
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Post by stoic on Dec 19, 2023 17:49:41 GMT
Akechi has only 4 Musket Adaptability, so even in this department he's underperforming as a Teppo general. We can only guess what the difference between Adaptability 3 and 4 really is. But usually it is 5-6 points of attack. Any idea how much damage that translates to on average? GCS seems to be much worse than other ET games at telling us what stats actually mean. True. I have no idea how Valor and points of Attack are interconnected and what is more important. One thing I did notice though: generals with higher Valor usually hit significantly harder than generals with low numbers. So, ranks of generals are really important because generals at rank 6 will have 40/45+ Valor points more than those at rank 1. That makes Akechi, Tokugawa and Hideyoshi outsiders in the long run, simply because daily missions are the only reliable way to upgrade their ranks so far. |
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Post by charlesmartell on Dec 20, 2023 5:50:38 GMT
Gold generals not only can get fragments from daily missions and leveling faster, but have more points when leveling, so in the long run average gold general should be better than average purple. And for valor, attack, adaptability and damage calculations I found this math (didn't prove it myself):
Adaptability:
Adaptability refers to the number of unit type
icons a general has. At 5 adaptability, the
general on its correlated unit type will have a
40% damage increase (from the number
attained in stage 1, units; the multiplier used
is unit damage x 1.4)
- it is not known the difference beteen 4 and
5, but it is assumed to be 8%.
- putting equipment that increases from 5 to
6 adaptability is unknown if it works, or if it is
diminishing
Important is that for units which take double
classes (ie, mounted archer, teppo bune), the
adaptability from both applies, with prioritity
given to the unit class the general is on.
Take mounted archer as an example: a
general with 5 MA adaptability will recieve a
x 1.4. However if this same general has say, 2
points of adaptability for horse, then the 40%
bonus is multiplied to include this extra 2
points (lets assume each adapatability is
8%). That means that the total is now 40 x
16%, giving us a new multiplier of 1.64 (64%
dmg buff from the unit damage)
- the alternative is that it is directly added on
top. Although this is less likely.
From this point on, the order is unknown, it
could also occur simultaniously.
Statistics:
Each general has 4 stats: valour, leadership,
intelligence and agility. Pertainting to the
damage formula (generals), is valour (directly
affecting) and leadership (indirectly
affecting). Valour literally just increases the
amount of damage dealt, while leadership
increaes morale and health, thus changing
the unit's % morale (possibly morale status if
it has been achieved), and max health.
It is suspected that leadership is applied first,
followed by valour, simply because it doesn't
create a logical fallacy as is, when it occurs
the other way around.
Leadership increases the morale (and max
morale) and the max health. This is applied
onto the damage formula (units), and then
fed back into the general section, onto the
next stage, the valour.
Valour directly increases damage dealt it is
not known by how much.
- in the event that the opposite is true, it
would most likely have that valour multiplies
the unit damage, and the implicit damage
gained from the leadership is added on top.
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Post by stoic on Dec 20, 2023 6:41:32 GMT
If it is not a scientific (or perhaps not scientific at all ) guess, then my practical conclusions are correct: Mori is the best general for commanding Mounted Archers  As to the leveling up... I don't think it is so pretty straightforward. Hideyoshi, for example, is a top tier general. But his Valor is his secondary attribute, so he will get less Valor points in the long run if compared to Shimazu, who has Valor as his primary attribute. The same is true about Akechi, who has a better basic Valor than Hideyoshi, but still it is not his primary attribute and in the long run he will be significantly weaker than Suzuki, for example. Unfortunately, Tokugawa also has a mediocre Valor at the start. |
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Post by Theron of Acragas on Dec 20, 2023 6:58:33 GMT
Important is that for units which take double classes (ie, mounted archer, teppo bune), the adaptability from both applies, with prioritity given to the unit class the general is on. Take mounted archer as an example: a general with 5 MA adaptability will recieve a x 1.4. However if this same general has say, 2 points of adaptability for horse, then the 40% bonus is multiplied to include this extra 2 points (lets assume each adapatability is 8%). That means that the total is now 40 x 16%, giving us a new multiplier of 1.64 (64% dmg buff from the unit damage) Is this confirmed? If so, that makes mounted archer and mounted teppo even more OP than I thought, and I guess makes Mori very strong after all. But do you know, if MA is counted as both cavalry and archer, do skills like cavalry mastery apply? If so, Shibata Katsuie is probably the best general out there (and is a strong alternative in any case). Edit: just tested Maeda on MA and his active doesn't work. That suggests skills don't apply, but it's perhaps not conclusive - it may be excluded because MA is archer, rather than not included because MA isn't cavalry. Looking for an archer-only active to confirm. Edit again: Chosokabe has an archer-only active, I don't have him but I can't believe it doesn't work for MA. Which would mean that active skills, at least, don't count the secondary type. |
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, who is an Infantry general but has two excellent skills for a teppo general...
