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Post by Kliment Jefremovitš Vorošilov on Jul 30, 2021 17:39:19 GMT
WW2, especially eastern front.
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Post by Kliment Jefremovitš Vorošilov on Jul 30, 2021 17:43:59 GMT
I can show some posts.
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Post by Gerd von Rundstedt on Jul 30, 2021 21:41:16 GMT
What were the main reasons, in your opinion, for the attack on Crimea?
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Post by Kliment Jefremovitš Vorošilov on Jul 31, 2021 1:33:12 GMT
Well, firstly Sevastopol was an important naval base for the red navy and secondly but maybe even more importantly the Soviet Air force bombed the Romanian oilfields from Crimean airfields, what Hitler demanded to be captured.
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Post by John Marston on Jul 31, 2021 2:35:52 GMT
Kliment Jefremovitš Vorošilov, During Stalingrad, assume you are Paulus. You need to retreat and regroup, but that would mean the Soviets might annihilate your scattered army and Hitler does not want that thing. What and why would you do?
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Post by Shrimant Peshwa Madhavrao Bhat on Jul 31, 2021 3:09:28 GMT
Crimean campaign was a waste of resources and time.
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Post by Kliment Jefremovitš Vorošilov on Jul 31, 2021 5:54:56 GMT
Kliment Jefremovitš Vorošilov, During Stalingrad, assume you are Paulus. You need to retreat and regroup, but that would mean the Soviets might annihilate your scattered army and Hitler does not want that thing. What and why would you do? Well, I would retreat from Stalingrad to a defensive line, because (this is a bit stupid saying this after the battle of Stalingrad has happened) the encirclement of the 6. Army would and did danger the encirclement of von Kluge's troops in the Caucasus which caused Hitler to authorize retreat. But Paulus was not the most decisive general and Stalingrad had become maybe almost an obsession to Hitler who wouldn't probably authorize retreat. I could have trusted that Göring could have supplied us and that Mansgein could have saved us, but that would be kind of stupid, since I think you are talking about what happened before the army got encircled. If I remember correctly there was a panzer divison coming to help in operation Winterstorm but half of them had to be left behind, because of bad weather and mechanical failures. Anyway, if I would retreat it would have 3 benefits atleast from a historian's point of view. 1. The Luftwaffe would be freed to help in the north and in the Caucasus, rather than hopelessly trying to supply the 6. Army in encirclement. 2. Most importantly a very important quarter of Germany's forces on the eastern front would be saved. 3. If i could stabilise a defensive line the Caucasus campaign could be continued without the threat of encirclement. |
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Post by Kliment Jefremovitš Vorošilov on Jul 31, 2021 5:59:58 GMT
Crimean campaign was a waste of resources and time. As I said the Soviet Black Sea fleet was a powerful force to which Sevastopol was crucial. Crimea had airfields where they had bombed Romanian oilfields and that is why Hitler demanded the immediate capture of Crimea, what considered vital. From these airfields the Germans could bomb the Caucasus oilfields respectively aswell. |
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Post by Shrimant Peshwa Madhavrao Bhat on Jul 31, 2021 6:09:27 GMT
Crimean campaign was a waste of resources and time. As I said the Soviet Black Sea fleet was a powerful force to which Sevastopol was crucial. Crimea had airfields where they had bombed Romanian oilfields and that is why Hitler demanded the immediate capture of Crimea, what considered vital. From these airfields the Germans could bomb the Caucasus oilfields respectively aswell. Germans would not have any strategic advantage in Black Sea even if Sevastopol fall. Since German plan in 1942 was to capture Caucasus, they should have focused their strength on capturing Caucasus, it will give them oil and Crimean defenders would surrender anyway if they were only ones defending on entire Black Sea cost. Soviet Airforce was not in situation to bomb Romania. |
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Post by Kliment Jefremovitš Vorošilov on Jul 31, 2021 6:18:59 GMT
As I said the Soviet Black Sea fleet was a powerful force to which Sevastopol was crucial. Crimea had airfields where they had bombed Romanian oilfields and that is why Hitler demanded the immediate capture of Crimea, what considered vital. From these airfields the Germans could bomb the Caucasus oilfields respectively aswell. Germans would not have any strategic advantage in Black Sea even if Sevastopol fall. Since German plan in 1942 was to capture Caucasus, they should have focused their strength on capturing Caucasus, it will give them oil and Crimean defenders would surrender anyway if they were only ones defending on entire Black Sea cost. Soviet Airforce was not in situation to bomb Romania. Leaving Sevastopol to the Soviets would endanger raw material supplies from Turkey. The Soviet airforce was almost destroyed in the first hours of Barbarossa, but they did still bomb Romanian airfields. Also just bypassing Crimea would tie troops to prevent the Soviets outflanking the German advance. |
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Post by Kliment Jefremovitš Vorošilov on Jul 31, 2021 6:45:33 GMT
Kliment Jefremovitš Vorošilov, During Stalingrad, assume you are Paulus. You need to retreat and regroup, but that would mean the Soviets might annihilate your scattered army and Hitler does not want that thing. What and why would you do? Well, I would retreat from Stalingrad to a defensive line, because (this is a bit stupid saying this after the battle of Stalingrad has happened) the encirclement of the 6. Army would and did danger the encirclement of von Kluge's troops in the Caucasus which caused Hitler to authorize retreat. But Paulus was not the most decisive general and Stalingrad had become maybe almost an obsession to Hitler who wouldn't probably authorize retreat. I could have trusted that Göring could have supplied us and that Mansgein could have saved us, but that would be kind of stupid, since I think you are talking about what happened before the army got encircled. If I remember correctly there was a panzer divison coming to help in operation Winterstorm but half of them had to be left behind, because of bad weather and mechanical failures. Anyway, if I would retreat it would have 3 benefits atleast from a historian's point of view. 1. The Luftwaffe would be freed to help in the north and in the Caucasus, rather than hopelessly trying to supply the 6. Army in encirclement. 2. Most importantly a very important quarter of Germany's forces on the eastern front would be saved. 3. If i could stabilise a defensive line the Caucasus campaign could be continued without the threat of encirclement. It might've been von Kleist not von Kluge who was commanding the Germans in the Caucasus. I don't remember. |
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Post by Shrimant Peshwa Madhavrao Bhat on Jul 31, 2021 7:28:05 GMT
Germans would not have any strategic advantage in Black Sea even if Sevastopol fall. Since German plan in 1942 was to capture Caucasus, they should have focused their strength on capturing Caucasus, it will give them oil and Crimean defenders would surrender anyway if they were only ones defending on entire Black Sea cost. Soviet Airforce was not in situation to bomb Romania. Leaving Sevastopol to the Soviets would endanger raw material supplies from Turkey. The Soviet airforce was almost destroyed in the first hours of Barbarossa, but they did still bomb Romanian airfields. Also just bypassing Crimea would tie troops to prevent the Soviets outflanking the German advance. It tied troops anyway. |
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Post by Kliment Jefremovitš Vorošilov on Jul 31, 2021 7:29:28 GMT
Leaving Sevastopol to the Soviets would endanger raw material supplies from Turkey. The Soviet airforce was almost destroyed in the first hours of Barbarossa, but they did still bomb Romanian airfields. Also just bypassing Crimea would tie troops to prevent the Soviets outflanking the German advance. It tied troops anyway. It would have tied for a longer time than when they took Crimea. |
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Post by Shrimant Peshwa Madhavrao Bhat on Jul 31, 2021 7:34:11 GMT
It would have tied for a longer time than when they took Crimea. Buy it would have tied less troops. |
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Post by Kliment Jefremovitš Vorošilov on Jul 31, 2021 7:39:18 GMT
It would have tied for a longer time than when they took Crimea. Buy it would have tied less troops. Yes, but as I said Crimea was a threat to Romanian oilfields and oversea supply routes. |
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