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Post by The Light Bringer on Oct 3, 2017 21:03:24 GMT
So that's the question, Vatutin is a solid tank general, Leeb is 2nd artillery when fully upgraded, I'll be able to get one of them in near time, question is which is a better choice for first general
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Post by soonerjbd on Oct 3, 2017 21:13:42 GMT
So that's the question, Vatutin is a solid tank general, Leeb is 2nd artillery when fully upgraded, I'll be able to get one of them in near time, question is which is a better choice for first general I would go with Vatutin. Tank generals are simply more useful because the HP bonus is now percentage based, so you get more health putting a general in a tank than in artillery. Artillery are pretty fragile now, particularly until you get the tech upgrades increasing chance to avoid retaliation. Vatutin can continue to be your first choice tank commander until you can afford Guderian, and he can serve as your third or fourth choice tank commander all the way through to end game. Tank generals can also match the damage output of artillery in most circumstances and get the chance to hit more than once in a round if they destroy a unit. You will use a tank general far more often than artillery commander. |
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Post by The Light Bringer on Oct 4, 2017 5:09:03 GMT
So that's the question, Vatutin is a solid tank general, Leeb is 2nd artillery when fully upgraded, I'll be able to get one of them in near time, question is which is a better choice for first general I would go with Vatutin. Tank generals are simply more useful because the HP bonus is now percentage based, so you get more health putting a general in a tank than in artillery. Artillery are pretty fragile now, particularly until you get the tech upgrades increasing chance to avoid retaliation. Vatutin can continue to be your first choice tank commander until you can afford Guderian, and he can serve as your third or fourth choice tank commander all the way through to end game. Tank generals can also match the damage output of artillery in most circumstances and get the chance to hit more than once in a round if they destroy a unit. You will use a tank general far more often than artillery commander. Yeah I know all that and in some way it is half of my point, but the other half is that Leeb is second best artillery general in game and I can upgrade him pretty much with the difference in price between both of them, so I am not sure where to go as as artillery is more fragile and it needs more movement and as tanks have better health and damage against most things I have a hard decision ahead of me😉 |
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Post by soonerjbd on Oct 4, 2017 5:21:25 GMT
Vatutin has end game utility, too. You’ll find yourself using three tank generals about as often as you use two artillery generals.
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Post by Józef Poniatowski on Oct 4, 2017 18:40:04 GMT
Id say neither, get messe and upgrade him or save the extra medals
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Post by The Light Bringer on Oct 4, 2017 18:49:13 GMT
Id say neither, get messe and upgrade him or save the extra medals Umm please explain yourself |
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Post by Józef Poniatowski on Oct 4, 2017 19:03:07 GMT
Alright, so to start out Vatutin in my opinion is a waste. He does not have rumor, which is important because it makes him able to confuse enemy generals, he is 1800 medals (which you dont have) and his stars are only good for armor. Leeb is a much better choice, because he is ~1300 medals, has rumor, and has much more versatility in his stars. The reason I pick messe over either is because he is the cheapest of the three at ~800, has up to 3 navy and 3 air stars which means he can be somewhat versatile, and he has rumor. With 1700 medals you can only upgrade leeb's rumor once, up to 30% chance, before you need to grind more. With 1700 you can make messe 5 armor stars, upgrade his rumor to 60% chance, and have some left over, which I think is the most preferable situation. I chose Leeb as my second, because he is a good general, but i would suggest messe for your first because of his upgrade ability, his cheap cost, and his versatility.
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Post by Józef Poniatowski on Oct 4, 2017 19:04:28 GMT
It is also worth pointing out Leeb starts out with a 128% health bonus while Vatutin starts out with 124%, furthering the advantages of leeb
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Post by Józef Poniatowski on Oct 4, 2017 19:07:15 GMT
In a straight up fight, leeb on a tank can still beat Vatutin (both of them stock) because leeb has rumor and rumor is I think the best 1v1 general skill in the game.
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Post by The Light Bringer on Oct 4, 2017 19:15:08 GMT
Alright, so to start out Vatutin in my opinion is a waste. He does not have rumor, which is important because it makes him able to confuse enemy generals, he is 1800 medals (which you dont have) and his stars are only good for armor. Leeb is a much better choice, because he is ~1300 medals, has rumor, and has much more versatility in his stars. The reason I pick messe over either is because he is the cheapest of the three at ~800, has up to 3 navy and 3 air stars which means he can be somewhat versatile, and he has rumor. With 1700 medals you can only upgrade leeb's rumor once, up to 30% chance, before you need to grind more. With 1700 you can make messe 5 armor stars, upgrade his rumor to 60% chance, and have some left over, which I think is the most preferable situation. I chose Leeb as my second, because he is a good general, but i would suggest messe for your first because of his upgrade ability, his cheap cost, and his versatility. Messe is a waste of medals, buying him is an option only if you can't grind to at the very least Leeb, I am choosing Vatutin as he is 3rd slot tank and he will stay in my team till endgame, while Leeb is second arty, tanks are better here. Anyway I'm too far in campaigns to get beginning gens, I'd feel too few changes in long run... |
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Post by The Light Bringer on Oct 4, 2017 19:17:34 GMT
In a straight up fight, leeb on a tank can still beat Vatutin (both of them stock) because leeb has rumor and rumor is I think the best 1v1 general skill in the game. Umm no, if you have damage skills combined with unit skills right, you can take out anything before rumor can even think about triggering, just look at Mannerheim, put him on Austrian commando and he will rip anything. |
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Post by soonerjbd on Oct 4, 2017 19:59:07 GMT
In a straight up fight, leeb on a tank can still beat Vatutin (both of them stock) because leeb has rumor and rumor is I think the best 1v1 general skill in the game. Umm no, if you have damage skills combined with unit skills right, you can take out anything before rumor can even think about triggering, just look at Mannerheim, put him on Austrian commando and he will rip anything. This. Rumor is virtually useless on end game tank generals. The only reason it is good on Messe is that you likely don’t have the tech or abilities to one-shot everything. Vatutin fully upgraded takes enemies down in 1 or 2 turns with any sort of support. Rumor is OK on artillery generals and great on naval generals because navy battles are much more prolonged, you can team up and flank more easily to get confusion more quickly and it is a real advantage when you have to grind down a naval general in a stacked cruiser or super battleship. You should be killing land generals so quickly with your tank commander that you never really even benefit from Rumor. |
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Post by soonerjbd on Oct 4, 2017 20:02:59 GMT
A fully upgraded Guderian with medals in a double or triple heavy tank does 300-plus damage 60 percent of the time when Panzer Leader triggers and 100-plus on normal hits. Pair him with an artillery general getting 200-plus hits, and nothing lasts for more than two rounds. My record hit with Guderian is more than 500 against an enemy infantry general. I’ve had Mannerheim hit for more than 400. No level of Rumor skill can help you against that.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 4, 2017 20:43:07 GMT
The biggest hit I got was with Manstein (skills fully upgraded with medals) against a Motorized Infantry : 561 damages.
Otherwise I advice to save medals to get Leeb. He is much cheaper than Vatutin and if you upgrade him, he can be without problem your main Artillery general even in the later stages of the game. I used Leeb with success in Cold War missions.
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Post by soonerjbd on Oct 4, 2017 20:50:47 GMT
The biggest hit I got was with Manstein (skills fully upgraded with medals) against a Motorized Infantry : 561 damages. Otherwise I advice to save medals to get Leeb. He is much cheaper than Vatutin and if you upgrade him, he can be without problem your main Artillery general even in the later stages of the game. I used Leeb with success in Cold War missions. I don’t understand why anyone would take Leeb as their first general. Tank generals are just objectively better and make the entire game easier. Leeb as second general? Fine. But if you could get Vatutin as first general, it will make life much easier and help you get more medals faster for subsequent generals. Plus, he can be used as secondary tank option through the end game. |
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